Menopause Matters Forum
Menopause Discussion => All things menopause => Topic started by: Witches Cat on February 01, 2016, 11:58:44 AM
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Morning all, I haven't posted very much on here recently, but have to mention this and ask if anyone else has suffered. In October I had my call up for my smear, never ever missed one, never had any probs.. but the October one the nurse had a problem doing. I was so dry, it's been like that for most of the last year, I know I have a retroverted uterus, and apparently that made it difficult as well, she said she didn't think she'd got enough cells and I'd probably get a recall but before that I'd need oestrogen tablets to insert (I can't have HRT due to it causing womb lining thickening in me, had to stop a year ago) Got a script for Vagifem 10mg (had to try other pharmacies as mine was on a limited supply and had run out) Used the stuff as prescribed, ended at Christmas, and had another appointment this morning. To start with it's still so dry, then she said I had a discharge, if I have it's never reached the outside world, she had 3 tries at getting the smear done, then went for a smaller speculum and had another go. Asked if I'd ever had children, I have, just the one, and he was 39 last week, Years back when inserting a coil, my doctor said I was very tiny inside, so I don't think it's anything new. A swab has gone off for testing, and she thinks she "might" have got enough cells now, but if not, it's back again in 3 months to do it all again, and this time try with a different nurse she says... When the doc gave me the script for the Vagifem she said she didn't know what to do if the next test came back with not enough cells as the result. But as I'm now 60, post meno, and never ever had a recall after a smear in my life, surely we can call it a day? I now hurt to sit or stand and am almost in tears at the thought of anything more coming my way. Have any of you ladies out there had this happen??? :-\
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That sounds awful I am not surprised you are in tears.
Why did you have to stop the Vagifem, is it because of the womb thickening? There is no way I could stop using mine and I am quite a bit younger than you.
A doctor at my surgery told me that if you had always had negative smears and had been in a long time partnership the risk of cervical cancer was extremely low...... She did add that perhaps she shouldn't say that!
I am pretty sure than can do smears at the hospital if your surged is having trouble doing one.
How long did you use the Vagifem for?
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Sorry it has hurt you so much. At my surgery they take a brush swab and it is tested for the virus HPV rather than trying to get enough cells. Wonder if this might be easier though I must admit I did find it quite painful last time I had it done ( though I have endometriosis on my cervix). I would think if that came back negative that you could probably just forget about future testing - it stops at 65 anyway.
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I think the HPV test is only done in certain areas at the moment, with the idea that it is rolled out everywhere at a later date...... I may be wrong on that though!
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Think you are right . Wonder if it is worth having test done at local GUM clinic as they might be better at it doing them more frequently.
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Sweetie sounds like you have atrophy and need Vagifem full time
Does the GP inderstand unless you have some underlying medical problem Vagifem can be taken
For life? Look I have to have a prepubecent childs plastic type speculum always have had
So your not Billy No Mates
A call back could be just as easy that they didnt get enough to test properly
When you go get Vagifem oyu need to be as normally lubricated as possible
Sending HUGE HUGS XXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXX
OH and make sure THE GP does the smear thats what hes paid to do not the nurse
Im AN ex nurse and the very thought of a nurse doing that no way jose
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Thank you for the replies, I only had the one pack of vagifem, it was 24 tablets in the applicators, I was on a high dose HRT for several years before that, and that's what caused the thickening, had ultra sound in hospital clinic where they checked the thickness, it was just under 7mm.. tried to do a biopsy but couldn't because of the tilted uterus, and told me to go "cold turkey" for 2 months then go back for another ultrasound, if the lining had thinned down, it was obvious the HRT was the cause, so no more of that... and then they'd forget the biopsy which would then have had to be under general anesthetic. Turned out to have gone back to 4mm... end of prob. Vagifem being local for the shortest time should have had no effect. They also said no moisuriser of any sort for at least 10 days before the smear, and they are even told not to use jelly, but just water to lubricate the speculum.... Same nurse did it last time...
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I was recently told by meno specialist that using Vagifem every day would not cause womb thickening and it was equivalent to one oral HRT tablet a year. I have a copy of the letter she sent to my GP telling him that.
Can you restart the Vagifem and go back in a few months time?
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Me too thats why I use Vagifem
My dinlaws MUM got breast cancer over 2 years ago been free for 14mnths YAYYYYYYYY
GP has given her Vagifem
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Because treatment for vaginal atrophy is applied locally there is little chance that the product will migrate enough to cause problems higher up. Absorption is around the vaginal area. It can be taken every day if necessary.
Maybe ask to see a Gynaecologist for a light GA for the next smear? It is important to get your smears regularly although I 'm not aware that my Mum has ever had one ::) - she's 89.
Are you taking Nurofen for any pain?
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My last one was under anaesthetic as they tried twice without, it was agonising and they still weren't able to do it properly and I was in pain for days after. Still hurt to walk for ages after the anaesthetic one, but at least I didn't have the pain at the time. Apparently, I'm 'abnormally narrow' which makes it harder to do (thanks, that makes me feel SO much better ::) ) Gynaecologist advised as I'm very low risk only to have a smear in future if I have any signs of a problem, but after my last experience, I think I'll be demanding anaesthetic again if I ever need another! Having said that, GP doesn't agree and keeps hassling me to have regular smears.
Sorry I can't offer advice to make it better, but I would just say that it's your body, so don't be afraid to shout for whatever is best for you. See if you can find a nurse who is more experienced/sympathetic/understanding as she may be able to suggest something that will make it less painful in future. Don't be afraid to make a fuss - you shouldn't have to cope with so much pain. I always thought bruising, fainting and pain were part of blood tests until I had a nurse who said she was going to try to get me through without fainting - she did and there was no pain or bruising either! Made me realise, an awful lot depends on how caring the nurse is. Some of them treat you like you are on a conveyor belt, so many to do per minute!
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Thank you all for your comments, Before lunch I'd been having a troll through some of the previous posts on here about Smear Tests and it's good to see I'm not that odd. I was just starting to calm down around luchtime, when I broke a back tooth, on my baguette, one the dentist was concerned about at my last checkup. So tomorrow afternoon I have to have a tooth out, and dentists have the same laxative effect on me as doctors, still, it's good to know I shan't be bunged up any time soon. I am keeping my fingers crossed that I don't need to have another smear test and there is no infection or anything else lurking down below. I do sometimes wish I was about 25 again, when everything was easy, all the family were healthy, and there no particular worries, those were the days, eh? ;)
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to the ladies who mentioned the HPV test, apparently that's what they will do, but she (nurse) still says they need enough cells... and hubby said to me this morning on the moisturiser front and about not using it, if they can't tell moisturiser from human cells it's a bad job. When I asked her about that, she said it obscures the view cuz they can't see through it, so that's why they've been told not even to use jelly.
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I am 54 and had my last smear last year. The previous one had been agonising and I had bled a bit but that nurse had been very rough so this time I saw a different nurse who straight away said very small speculum on older ladies ::) and she used loads of gel and it was uncomfortable but bearable. Our area do the hpv brush test and even with loads of gel they read mine okay. I cannot imagine the pain if they don't use any gel :o
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They used that jelly stuff last time I had a smear, I know as it always makes my skin sting.
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They also said no moisuriser of any sort for at least 10 days before the smear, and they are even told not to use jelly, but just water to lubricate the speculum....
And...They used that jelly stuff last time I had a smear.
It makes me so mad that this sort of thing happens - one rule for one practice and another rule for another...and it's us poor women who are stuck in the middle. As for avoiding cream for 10 days before a smear - leave me without my cream for 10 days and I would probably murder anyone who went within 3 feet of my vagina! :o
I've just come back from seeing the practice nurse for my next batch of BCP and guess what she raised? Oh yes, I'm overdue for a smear and must have one! In spite of being told by 2 gynaes and a GP that I am very low risk and it's up to me if I don't want to have one. Just hoping this practice is better than my last one - they started withholding treatments because I wouldn't have a smear. (A smear which would have been with the same nurse who acted like she was trying to rip me apart when she did it before and told me I was making a fuss about nothing when I said it was excruciatingly painful!)
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Hi Witches Cat
Sorry to hear about your painful smear. As the others have said you should be on Vagifem all the time to keep things healthy down there because once you get VA it doesn't go away without local oestrogen and comes back if you stop. Defo get a repeat prescription for Vagifem, do a re-load of every day for a fortnight then use twice a week - and hopefully things will improve.
As for having to stop HRT permanently because of a thickened lining - this is just not necessary! All it means is that you did not have enough progestogen relative to oestrogen in your HRT combo. I presume you were on a proprietary HRT continuous combined combo either patch or gel? Progestogen can be used to thin the ling and then if the combo was causing thickening you can use separate oestrogen and progestogen instead - and have a higher dose of progestogen until you find the right dose which keeps the lining thin. How have you been off HRT?
I hope the Vagifem does the job so they can take enough cells next time :)
Hurdity x
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Just to set the recorded straight. If a practice nurse has had the appropriate training which they are particularly strict on now, she would know that lubricant is ALWAYS recommended with use of a speculum. It is placed on the top outer sides, so doesn't interfere with the sample of cells taken. With regard to oestrogen prep prior to a cervical smear, this should be used at least two weeks before right up to the day of the smear. A small speculum sometimes is sufficient, but if a lady is tall a regular one has to be used to be able to visualise the cervix. So sorry you had a bad experience Witchescat! I would mention next time so the nurse is pre warned that you have a retroverted cervix and that your past experience was very uncomfortable.
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Thank you everyone, I have been off HRT for just over a year now, I was getting over the sweats but recently with problems with family (we are only carers for hubby's father with Alzheimer's) anything that worries me sends me into a spin and makes the sweats worse. Our customers are fairly understanding, father-in-law won't have a carer and as he's the "end user" and can still have a say, then we are on our own, thank the lord he's only half a mile away. My HRT was (Oh God, I've forgotten, but it was a conti) Ah, remembered.. Elleste duet conti, still can't remember what strength. when I had to stop I was given femoston? for a month just as a step down... And then nothing... the dryness started about 6 months ago... and as for height 5 foot 2 inches in the morning, and on my knees by bedtime.
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So hard work being a carer...bless you! I came off HRT a while back, but recently restarted to help lift me out of depression, I'm postmenopausal and like you with recent stresses and anxiety the flushes and night sweats are back. I am using Oestrogel bio identical HRT. It worked well for me last time, so here's hoping! Who'd be a women eh!
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You can not be made to have a smear
No Doctor can with hold medicine if you refuse you can report them
I had my smear my GP told me to take my Vagifem every night for 4 nights befoe I had the smear
That was the 25m ones THESE are PATHOLOGISTS they know whats what
Sounds like you have a GP who thinks us old f..ts arent worth wasting practise money on
DONT let a NURSE near you say no thanks I want a Doctor
I am always amased its 2016 yet so many still treat GPS as GODS yes sir no sir three bags full sir
I came home last year cos Of Dad and ended up going to Casuality nurse started doing all the things a Doctor should do I stopped her said look love Im an ex nurse no disrespect
BUT I want to see a Doctor I got a doctor OK I know I live in Ozz but I paid my taxes 15/27
Served my country got shot at in Nrthn Ireland I blasted deserve to access National Health
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I have always given all medics a wide berth SuziQ, I don't go looking for trouble, I'd rather see what I can do to help myself first. What did make me wonder about the knowledge of the person attending to me was this... she phoned 2 weeks ago to say I hadn't left the appointment for the repeat smear long enough and she wanted me to put it off for another 2 weeks (that was why the appt was yesterday) on the phone I told her I was using Replens since I had finished the Vagifem, but she'd never heard of it, said she wasn't a sexual health nurse and not to use it until I'd had the next smear. Yesterday I was telling her how tuned in I am to my own body, right down to using the "Persona" box of tricks, for contraception 1o or so years ago (still on sale now) and how I could tell before doing the stick and urine test what colour light I was gonna get on the display, (red or green) she's not heard of that either and they've been about I would think at least 16 years.
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Hello everyone, good news on the smear test results, this morning my letter came saying everything was fine, still can't make out why the nurse who did the test on both appointments (3 months apart) saw fit to wind me up so much. It wasn't as if she was just having an "off day" Will make sure if I ever have to go back for anything "down there" that I don't see her. Where she was insisting I had an infection that was causing a discharge, that's clear too. Can't make it out. Anyway, all I have to worry about now, is having a tooth out tomorrow. Thanks for all your support, :cat48:
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That is good news about smear result ..I had a tooth out last year, was out before I could think too much about it. Just make sure you take painkillers as soon as you get home, don't wait until the numbness wears off....I did :(