Menopause Matters Forum
Menopause Discussion => All things menopause => Topic started by: BrightLight on November 09, 2015, 09:11:18 PM
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Hi - first I should mention that I have got myself in a worried state today about this, yesterday I was fine! Looking for some rational and knowledgeable info.
I started this perimenopause journey in earnest last January when I period that was spotting for days resulted in blood tests that said I was postmenopausal with high FSH! A subsequent test had my FSH at normal. Dr jumped the gun............... >:(
From that point on my periods have not been at the regular 25/26 day intervals. I have a few that are around that length 24. 27. 22 and then a gap to 39 followed by a short one of 16 days. Then a few again around 23. 22. 26 and then another long gap 37 and a short one of 17 days. So I guess there is a pattern there.............sort of
The bleeding isn't heavy as such, but it just feels like it's out of control - the periods don't slowly start and peak and peter out as they have all my life. They arrive and are full on (more watery) and then stop. It feels as though it is a lot of bleeding but it's more like a sense of evacuation (sorry for TMI) and I get awful water retention and feel like I go down a dress size within a day of starting my period.
Today I started worrying if there was something wrong because I had a short cycle again! I read on the NHS website that cycles shortening and lengthening is normal but then read somewhere else about having no progesterone (no ovulation) causing these type of bleeds and that can lead to thickened lining - but it's all normal in perimenopause.
Aaaargh - my anxiety is kicking in about it not being OK and that hyperplasia is happening and I've ignored it! Today I also felt I actually have had enough of feeling like my body is not working properly. I presume I need to look for even more random bleeding and spotting - I had one instance of mild spotting in the middle of the 39 day stretch which I put down to a period trying to happen. I have also been doing temp tracking and it does go up and stay up most cycles which suggests to me an attempt at ovulation - but that could be baloney!!!
Other symptoms are manageable - the cravings for fat, occassional overheating, lack of energy, hair loss that stops and starts again, skin that is up and down - that's all fine and not as bad as it was.
Can anyone advise what to look for with hyperplasia or is it a case of asking DR to check somehow - I dont want to avoid taking care but I do know that tonight I am irrational and dont want to rush to Dr as I am pretty sure after last year of going with all sorts of issues they have me down as a difficult patient! I have only been twice this year and felt calm and steady until today - I could actually cry with the fear of cancer and problems that has grown in my head today :'(
Oh - I am 45 and not using HRT so far
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Thank you Sparkle - I think I will visit the doctor and register with her where I am at with cycles becoming irregular, I think it just dawned on me that I am fairly sure they are annovulatory, even though I am bleeding which means I have been low on progesterone for quite some time and then my head got itself all worried.........this could all be very normal and it sounds like it is, but for some reason I just feel more aware of potential issues with this type of bleeding than I did yesterday!!! crazy ha
I have very mild other symptoms - they do seem to coincide with mid cycle (even when they are short) and just before my period - I get hotter at night for a couple of days and definately more anxiety before my period but.....tender breasts and any cramping are long gone (although I didn't really get these before). I just don't have the same sense that things are robust if that makes sense, that everything is a symptom of imbalance, no real sense of ovulation that I used to have - perhaps estrogen is actually low and no ovulation is triggered who knows...........I am relieved to assume that a scan is how they check - not invasive, that puts my mind at rest a bit if the GP does think I need to have things checked.
I'm quite happy to accept things are ok if they advise so, I just think I want to tell them about the change in cycles, it has helped to write it down x
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Brightlight you are exactly where I was a couple of years ago- long cycles short cycles. That is how things started for me. Hope that helps.x
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Brightlight you are exactly where I was a couple of years ago- long cycles short cycles. That is how things started for me. Hope that helps.x
Thank you x
I woke up this morning and realised my anxiety has a lot to do with not quite accepting these changes and losing my confidence and staying power to go with it all. I didn't have children and no friends to talk to about all this at 45 they are mostly in a different place, with children focus etc. I am just a bit fed up of the periods, they are not heavy, probably lighter really, just weird, mostly into the toilet and wiping and over in a few days - it all just feels yuk. Having a period twice in a month happened a few months ago and now this time and hope it doesnt continue :(
Tried to make a Dr's appt but have to ring in the morning and see if I can get one on the day - they don't pre book for this week, only next. Will go and have a chat, because I think that's what I need more than anything, someone just to know what is going on for me. Feeling really lonely right now
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:hug:
Bless you,I know it's not the same but you have all of us . ;)
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Yes Brightlight you have us to talk to any time and you are not alone. It is so strange that little details shared make us feel so much better. I was thinking of your mention of the lighter periods only when you wipe thing- I have had this and thought it was strange- no worrying - then my hairdresser, who is more like a friend than anything, told me she had the same. The thing I love about this site is that you can talk about anything, and it is often the little details that worry us the most. xx
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It is good to hear of other 'strange' symptoms being similar with others - I managed to get an appointment tomorrow with the GP. I am still such a mess today - now I am joining up all the others changes in the last year to mean something awful - I am terrible at the doctors, I either don't really go and when I do, I wonder if I should tell them every little thing incase they need to know to spot something!!! Driving myself up the wall - I have found it really hard on this journey to know when something that changs is significant or not, most of the things come and go.
Thanks for your kind thoughts and words x
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Now you got the appointment,good for you positive step, make a list tonight of all your concerns/symptoms as you only get ten minutes and if you 're like me bound to forget something ! ::)
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Now you got the appointment,good for you positive step, make a list tonight of all your concerns/symptoms as you only get ten minutes and if you 're like me bound to forget something ! ::)
Good idea - I have made a short list and notes of my cycle lengths over the last six months - they are erratic! Although there is some sort of pattern in retrospect ha - not one that has me forewarned unfortunately ;)
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Hi BrightLight
Sorry to hear that your cycles and bleeding are making you so worried. As the others have said anything and everything is normal in peri-menopause - and it is likely that the hormonal changes themselves are making you more anxious than otherwise.
Remember back to that article on here "The Perils of the Periomenopause" where its explains what is happening.
If you are still having cycles albeit irregular it is very likely you are ovulating some of the time. If you were having anovulatory cycles at this point (early peri) and didn't have a bleed, and there was enough oestrogen for the lining to build up, when you next ovulated the bleed would be heavy. It is very difficult to work out exactly what is happening with each individual woman but rest assured the cycle variability is normal. If your lining got too thick without ovulation you would then get oestrogen breakthrough bleeding - but I woud have thought this would also be heavy - if the lining had got thick enough to spontaneously break away. Some women get a bit of oestrogen withdrawal bleeding (spotting) after ovulation but there is no way of knowing.
Please don't worry about your doctor thinking you're difficult - after all wasn't it your doc who worried you in the first place by telling you you were post-menopausal and wouldn't have another period?! I think they owe you some explanation and reassurance in the circumstances - and if that means a referral for a scan then so be it. I don't think a doc would normally refer at this point since it doesn't sound like cause for concern. It's very heavy bleeds that can be more of a worry.
Anyway good luck with the doctor and try not to worry!
Hurdity x
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Hi BrightLight,
I thought I'd share my pattern with you just so you can see how unpredictable peri can get... I have an app for tracking periods. It also tracks pain (ovulatory, headache, boob pain) emotions, bleeding, fluid, energy, mental state, and digestion. All I'll say is there's no discernible pattern to any of it so I've learned to expect the unexpected.
So here it is - 29, 28, 28, 25, 30, 49, 30, 49, 24, 23, 27, 53, 83, 55, 60.
I hope you feel more reassured after your visit today.
Galadriel x
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Thank you so much Hurdity & Galadriel x
Miraculously my visit to the GP was a much better experience than previously, I have found a lovely female doctor who is straight forward and I am beginning to trust her. I think I lost trust earlier this year. I did mention the 'diagnosis' of menopause and how it has left a background thought of his words that I am now at higher risk of heart disease and osteoporosis due to age and low hormones. She assured me that HRT would have been offered by her if I was still in a position indicating impending menopause but as I had a normal FSH and clearly have hormones this is not a consideration in the way it was presented to me.
Going back to the irregular bleeding she absolutely confirmed all that you have told me in that this is normal, a change, but normal and that bleeding can happen after a week or even days. I was most worried by quite short cycles close together. I explained I wasn't really sure how heavy it was as a lot wasnt on the pad and water retention being lost etc but it seems heavy and full on for a few days then stops. She nodded in recognition for most of my descriptions :)
Her approach is to send women for a scan to see if there is another cause of extra bleeding and mentioned polyps. She must have read my mind as she said I do not think you have cancer.
After that she explained that after we check for any other reason for extra bleeding I can consider hormone therapy if I like, perhaps some progesterone or even try soy, which is unlikely to solve everything but might help. I asked about anything to help with the massive water retention I am getting and she suggested a celery stick a day! So I will try that.
It will be 4-6 weeks wait for the scan and I asked about treatment if they find a polyp or fibroid and she explained that. I do feel a bit better although I know I will still worry about sinething being found and any treatment I need but sensibly I know that having a check and if I need treatment getting it will help me further along as I continue to deal with all this change.
Thanks so much for being there, its very helpful to share. x
Ps I completely forgot to mention my worry about thick lining! That worry came from the extra bleeding and seeing as she has decided to check that out, I guess that would be noted then too. She made no mention of thickened lining.
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If you are not ovulating, then you will not be producing progesterone from mid-cycle.
Oestrogen causes the cells of the lining to divide and proliferate. Progesterone modifies them, stops them proliferating, and organises the tissues and blood vessels to form a suitable medium for conception. At the end of the cycle the hormone levels drop, the blood vessels go into spasm and the lining is sloughed off.
If you do not ovulate, then the tissue does not get nicely organised and will come away in patches whenever it gets a bit thick, or when the oestrogen level drops. This will bleed more, and hurt more and as it never fully clears, it will bleed unpredictably.
It is the sort of thing mirena is good for, and maybe I should have given it a go ::) but I am too squeamish. Also, I thought you just 'missed' periods and then had a big one but it is not that simple - I did 18 months of charting after I came off the pill and never had a gap bigger than 24 days. The lack of pattern within a 'period' is annoying too - I went along to a local meeting once and had to rush out as I had sudden flooding and pain on the afternoon of day 3.
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Hi BrightLight - Great that your doctor is listening to your worries and sending you for checks to make sure nothing is amiss to re-assure you (hopefully). Let's hope all is OK and then you will worry less?
Celery :o oo-er - I haven't heard of that one! I've never had water retention but I know celery is extremely low caloriie and very fibrous - wonder if that has something to do with it? Or perhpas it's a diuretic? Sounds like it's worth a try - I'm all for dietary ways to deal with problems if possible because they don't cost much, are not concentrated and won't do you any harm if you overdose!! :)
Good luck with your scan!
Hurdity x
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I believe celery is a diuretic ;)
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Do you know what Galadriel, I bet if I'd kept a record of mine they'd be similar to yours especially the last four!
Brightlight - hope this makes you smile a little bit. Back in June I asked my GP if I could have a scan to check what stage my fibroids were at in the hope they might be getting smaller for one! They have a scan clinic at the surgery every two weeks so she booked me in there and then. Had the scan (vaginal and external). Good news was the fibroids looked smaller (yay!) but she could also see a small cyst on one of my ovaries (just for a change!) but she was happy it was a follicular cyst so nothing to worry about. Finally she said the lining look fine and it didn't look as if I would have a period just yet which was great news as I'd just told her I was going on holiday for a week the following day. The following day lo and behold brown discharge that then rumbled on for the whole of my holiday! Just goes to show how unpredictable this whole peri lark is! ::)
Let us know how you get on and good luck!
You are well rehearsed in these matters - it did make me smile :)
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Hi BrightLight - Great that your doctor is listening to your worries and sending you for checks to make sure nothing is amiss to re-assure you (hopefully). Let's hope all is OK and then you will worry less?
Celery :o oo-er - I haven't heard of that one! I've never had water retention but I know celery is extremely low caloriie and very fibrous - wonder if that has something to do with it? Or perhpas it's a diuretic? Sounds like it's worth a try - I'm all for dietary ways to deal with problems if possible because they don't cost much, are not concentrated and won't do you any harm if you overdose!! :)
Good luck with your scan!
Hurdity x
Thank you - I don't really want to go and see what is going on in there :o But as it's happening, it will be a good thing.
There has been a niggle in the back of my mind about a fibroid I had diagnosed in my 30's and a couple of burst cysts in my lifetime, none of which showed symptoms and a cervical polyp that I had removed 2 years ago, that didn't bleed either. I think my anxiety brain has made a connection that my body 'grows' things well with estrogen eeek. I know it doesn't really work as simply as that in any stretch of the imagination but just having a check to see where I am at as it were is probably a good thing in general.
I was quite clear that my concern wasn't really the heavy flow - which for me is heavier but not really heavy in comparison to normal ranges and that I had a couple of 17-18 day cycles with what appear to be normal periods - not dribs and drabs, the whole works, but I guess if my body is trying to find eggs, I might ovulate quite soon after my period and in theory an 18 day cycle is possible.
It is all hypothesis but if there is a polyp or fibroid or thickening (eek, I hope not as I know that will freak me out ongoing until this all ends) then there is the possibility of lightening the bleeding - yay!
I was also thinking about the wise woman part of my brain - if I dig deep, I have to trust that my body knows what it is doing, even if there is something amiss, it is attempting to do it's best and I just need to take care as much as I can. I do think my bleeding is OK really, I do think my body is clearing out etc, despite not having the right ratio of hormones - it certainly feels like it anyway! Semi PMT symptoms sort of give me that idea - infact the symptoms I have are very similar to all the very mild ones I had when regular - just ramped up x 3!!!
I just realised a 4-6 wait for an appointment is Christmas time - hope it is before and can get it out of the way.
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dahliagirl - I think that was the theory that set me wondering how long it's 'good' to have no progesterone and only cycle with estrogen!!! It's impossible to tell if I am ovulating - I think maybe I am at times. Hopefully I am, that way things might be balancing out!!! Some of the cycles have spotting before and after for quite some time, I tend to think these are anovulatory - the others, I think are 'normal' or at least the 'new' normal. It is all guesswork but I think it sensible the GP send me for a scan, I think if this carries on, she might be bound to do that anyway, just to check. I'm not sure.
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Yes - it worries me too.
I can't work out what happens to the lining as your oestrogen levels settle out. Does it keep coming away, or does it sit there for years ? ::)
I tried charting and did not see any ovulation in 18 months, except perhaps the last month. It was very difficult to get the Basal Body temperature right. If you take it every morning at 6am, but you have been awake from 2am, it goes up. If you crash out and are woken by the alarm at 6am, it goes down. It is hard to do for menopause ;D
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My periods have changed completely and I now seem to have 2 weeks on 2 weeks off!! Again like you say not really heavy, just annoying! I don't get many other symptoms really but I guess because my periods are regular I won't. I do get quite angry at points, so have learnt when to keep my mouth shut ;D and warm as well at some points during the month.
I was referred to the hospital and had every test and scan going and al they found was a functional cyst on my ovary. I guess it is the joys of peri. I am just waiting to get longer gaps between periods and not shorter :)
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After saying my bleeding wasn't heavy - this one is heavy, starting to stop now, but longer than 'usual'. I feel I shouldn't be moaning really as I have never had heavy periods my entire life, maybe that is why it feels so alarming to me. I am pretty sure that this is happening because of a few annovulatory cycles either last cycle or before - I don't have cramps, but do have weird fluttering and my ankles always swell - I can pretty much tell when the bleeding is winding down by looking at the water rention - this has only happened a couple of times this year - the first time was after a period was delayed and the ankle swelling heralded a bleed that the doctor said I wouldn't have again and also told me the swelling was not hormonal - it most certainly is.
I am just thinking out loud here and having attempts at thinking how I can try and calm this down myself, I have not been doing my excercise for a few weeks as I had a really bad cold/sinusitis. Maybe the excercise and gut health help lower excess estrogen/get rid of it - so I am back on my regime in earnest in the hopes I don't have this experience next time.
Meanwhile I am wondering if the fibroid from years ago has now grown to epic proportions (nothing like the unknown to spark the imagination ;) ) When my periods first went amiss in January, I went to the GP because I had awful cramps and pain in hip and ovary and was convinced it was a cysts or fibroid and I was dismissed.
I think an ultrasound is going to help me to manage this - at least then the GP will know what we are treating, hormones only or extra issues. I seem to have stopped worrying about the lining and now more focussed on reducing this bleeding. It isn't unmanageable but if it happens more often, it's going to be a stress - last time was about 4 months ago I think.
Anyone know whether you can reduce/balance estrogen with diet and excercise?