Menopause Matters Forum
Menopause Discussion => All things menopause => Topic started by: pepperminty on September 02, 2015, 05:40:37 AM
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Oh God,
Just started the Pill yesterday and have woken up nauseous and terrified . I can't stop crying and feel so ill. I want to be sick .
OMG what do I do? I can't bear this at all I am terrified. I was fine yesterday. Really feel like I can't go on.
TERRIFIED TERRIFED TERRIFIED. I can't get out of bed . I want to be sick ,
Do I start taking the HRT again of keep with the pill and hope? I don't know what to do? I cannot function like this . Overnight I have gone from normal to this on one pill .
Peppeminty xx
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I have loose bowels and bad head and I cannot function for any longer like this.
I don't know if it is safe to take the HRT again today . I cannot think at all I am scared.
Pmintyxx
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Hi Pepperminty
I'm sorry to hear you feel like this, it sounds very familiar as I'm like it most days! It sounds to me like you are experiencing some anxiety, I'm not sure if one pill would do this so soon. Maybe phone your doctor and see what they say, why did you switch from HRT to the pill? Could you switch back? Hope it doesn't last too long for you, I know how nasty it is to feel like this.
Shellb
xXx
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pepperminty - I'd just stop everything for now and give your body a chance to recover. It won't matter you are are not getting any hormones for a week or two and this might give you a chance to reassess things. If you keep chopping and changing then you can never find a solution. DG x
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I agree with Dancing girl. I used to take so much different stuff (but not HRT) and my body didn't know which way was up. I was taking medication to counteract the effects of medication. The effects of cutting right back was no worse and gave me time to evaluate what I really needed to take and what could be managed.
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Pepperminty, please do update us on how you are. I am hoping you phoned the GP or somebody who could perhaps sit with you for a while.
thinking of you x
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Hi ladies,
It is so difficult to be rational when you are in a state. I have calmed down a bit and have decided that the surge of hormones doesn't agree with me.
The same thing happened on the 2/10 Hrt when I upped the dose , but it took 2 weeks to have this effect and the pill is a higher dose still , so I suspect that is why it has done this over night.
My moods are fine on the 1/10 it is just the tiredness and long periods , but at least I can function. I felt better immediately when I went back on the 1/10 overnight before , so I think I need to do that and stop the pill even though I have only taken one tablet.
I cannot keep on taking it in the hope that in days / weeks /months it kicks in because I need to function and I cannot even go out today.
Funny how yesterday I was absolutely fine!!
The doctor just sent a message to me via the secretary and he said to keep on for one week and see how I feel. I just said that I cannot function like this and if it carries on I will be completely at the end of my tether as I cannot leave the house. I cannot take another day of this let alone a week.
I think this has taught me that I can function on a low dose and any increase sends me haywire?
On a positive note at least I tried I suppose.
It is very hard when you are living alone and trying to evaluate yourself. Or make a decision. At least I can function on 1/10, without the anxiety.
The GP is supposed to be getting back to me again, but I think I have made up my mind that 1/10 is the answer at present, until I see the meno nurse again, as I need to get the periods sorted so they are shorter.
Still in a state , but more in control.
Thanks for your support
Peppermintyxx
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:foryou:
Hope you see some improvement soon .
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My best friend is out all day , so I am alone. Can't stop crying. I am in a new relationship and want to feel fine for that, if that makes sense, as I can hardly leave the house, so how can I date like this ? Sorry I am rambling , but I have to unload.
I look awful overnight too again. Trouble is when I get like this I get all the emotional symptoms and the physical ones together, so I am paralysed.
I know I haven't gone nuts if that makes sense, it is just hormonal.
This is when you need some one to give you a hug. Thanks everyone for posting , so I don't feel so alone.
Lets hope tomorrow I will be posting that I am fine . But for the moment I feel like a wreck.
Pmintyxx
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Thanks Sparkle,
she will call me later this afternoon, and I can hopefully talk through it with her as when you are like this you need a calming voice of reason.
My Gp said take it for a week - but how can I be like this for a week , I know that even if I take it again I may be ok tomorrow, but I am too scared to take the chance if I am not as I cannot stand being a lunatic crying uncontrollably and feeling ill.
I have phoned the meno nurse and hopefully she should call me back and I want to ask her what I can do about the long periods on Femeston - so I can at least weigh up my options logically. I didn't discuss that with her previously as I was going on the pill!!
I am not feeling so physically unwell , but I am still exhausted and emotional.
It is so hard to make a decision for the best.
I do need to talk through the options logically, somehow.
Pmintyxx
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Hi just spoken to meno nurse who said stick with the 1/10 for 4 months and come back to see her. She also suggested coming off everything and seeing what happens, but I am too scared to do that. She said that she can evaluate everything then.
She found it difficult to believe that one tablet could do that to me, and thought it maybe anxiety and seemed a bit miffed I had seen my GP, which wasn't very helpful. So 1/10 for 4 months and then review I suppose.
I know it isn't anxiety causing this I was actually fine going to bed , just woke up like this with physical symptoms.
I am really worried, and can't seem to stop.
Pmintyxx
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My boyfriend just text me and said he will call me later to discuss, bless him. I suppose it kind of effects him too as he doesn't like to see me like this.
I am still teary, but hopefully I will be ok tomorrow after I have stopped the pill and had friend and boyfriend talk logically to me going through the options.
Thanks everyone again.
Pmintyxx
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glad to see you are okay, though not much further forward really :-\
I know nothing about the hrt either, so cant help. I do know what that feels like though, or at least when the anxiety is bad and makes me feel totally out of control.
sure you will feel lots better later with your friend and BF to chat too.
take care x
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Thanks again ladies, this forum can be a life line .
I am a bit miffed with the menopause nurse as she implied that my anxiety was self imposed in a way, well funny how it went on 1/10 then! She seemed to think that it should have gone completely on 2/10 as well, and couldn't understand why it made me manic. She seemed to think I had a duff packet of 2/10.I showed her a picture of how I looked after 2/10 and it wasn't pretty. Funny how when I stopped it went back to normal , I know the mind is a powerful thing , but I really wish professionals would stop assuming we are all depressed and need counselling when it is a hormonal issue causing the problem. That's treating the symptom , not the cause.
My boyfriend has suggested taking one more pill to see if I have any effects tomorrow, and I understand that he is coming from a contraceptive standpoint as that would make things easier from a sex point of view, but he also says that he will support me whatever and he will I know.
So can I cope with taking it again if I know I have the support if it goes tits up tomorrow?
I really do not know what to do for the best.
I suppose my main worry was being a lunatic for a while - and it effecting my relationship. Maybe I should try the pill for one more night and see how I feel tomorrow? I am feeling physically better now , but still teary.
Should I give it a week and put up with the symptoms and see will I get anymore symptoms?
I don't know what to do!
Pmintyxx
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OH YES IT CAN!
When I went on The Pill I was sick after 2 tablets :-\ ::) …….. Mum thought I was pregnant :o ……… my GP at the time gave me a different Pill. Do not rely on it for contraception!!!! get the boyfriend to use condoms ;) because if you are vomiting then the effect will be GONE!!!
The sudden burst of added hormone can upset the whole body. How do you feel now?
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Pepperminty, so sorry to hear this. It's a horrible place to be, made worse if you're alone. So glad your boyfriend's able to see you this evening.
You must be ultra sensitive to the estrogen. I wonder if it's the fluctuations your body doesnt like, or the estrogen per se? I think with me, it's any form of fluctuation - up or down - that sets things awry. If that is the case, then you should feel better v soon ... if you can stand the time in between? Alternatively, have you ever tried a patch? It would be less potent than the synthetic estrogen in Mercilon.
Your nurse sounds as helpful as a chocolate tea pot. High and low estrogen can both cause anxiety - as ladies' experiences on here frequently demonstrate. The fact yours goes crazy when levels change suggests you're sensitive to the fluctuations rather than it being an external cause, unconnected to hormones. She was all you needed today! If you're stuck, have you considered either emailing Dr Currie or else going to your local FPC? They were so helpful when I went for advice regarding the pill and peri menopause a while back.
Anyway, pointless me asking you questions at this moment. If you're anything like me, then simply logging on will be an ordeal when you feel like this, let alone having to function enough to create a coherent response!
Just wanted you to know that - like the others here - I am thinking of you.
B xxx
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Hi Everyone ,
thank you so much for your support it really has helped. I think it definitely is the sudden burst of hormones that I am sensitive too. And the pill is a lot stronger dose.
I am feeling less wired now, but I suspect that is somewhat to do with the fact that the pill has worn off a bit. Also my friend has just left and she has seen me through the whole HRT saga and she thinks going by my symptoms as I do, that it is the stronger doses that effect me.
I am going to have something to eat and try to relax - what a waste of a day being unable to function.
I think I am better off on the lower dose.
Actually being more coherent now, just goes to show that the effects are wearing off!!
My man has been a sweety calling me and being supportive, so that is a relief.
I was actually quite hopeful yesterday, that it would work , but you live and you learn.
Just exhausted now but more with it.
Pmintyxx
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have a good evening, and hope tomorrow is a better day for you. :)
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Pminty so sorry to hear you are feeling rough.
One way of coping might be to treat yourself as though you have flu..... Be nice to yourself, know that it will get better, don't expect too much of yourself, do as little as possible, eat what you fancy when you fancy, curl up and watch tv, don't expect a good nights sleep and hope that it's gone in 4 - 8 days.
Many menopausal symptoms I believe are due to fluctuations rather than lack of hormones and it could be you are extra sensitive to fluctuations.
Look after yourself and let us know how you are tomorrow ?
Xx
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ladies thank you so much again.
I have had a hot water bottle and blanket all day, so unlike me as I am normally hot!! Especially during a period!
I have had a hot bath and I am going to have an early night.
Again this has been a life saver today knowing I have support out there, I will post tomorrow with better news hopefully.
Peppermintyxx
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Don't take The Pill again!
Enjoy your bath.
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ladies thank you so much again.
I have had a hot water bottle and blanket all day, so unlike me as I am normally hot!! Especially during a period!
Peppermintyxx
I've never really had a flush, but always get the chills when I have hormonal nausea and fatigue. Hot water bottle really helps, regardless of outside temperature, as does a hot drink in your hands (even if you dont feel like drinking it). Hope things will have eased by Thursday xx
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As for the Nurse, anxiety cannot be imagined :bang: :bang: :bang: no wonder you feel miffed! ::)
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i agree dont take the pill... i just knew the progestrone tabs were making me ill.. even when dr said carry on ..i knew.. so stopped immediately.. glad your feeling calmer, xxx
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Only just been able to log on now. You poor thing, I am so sorry you had such a horrible reaction to the Pill. You know I totally understand where you're coming from when it comes to sudden and extreme mood dips and anxiety.
I agree with others who have said it is perfectly possible to react very quickly and intensely to hormones. I am the poster for it. I can switch from feeling bleak despair mixed with anxiety to feeling calm and centered in the time it takes to drink a coffee.
Also like you I can go to sleep feeling 'normal' and then wake at 4am feeling so wired and jittery that I feel nauseous.
I agree with Briony that you're likely to be reacting to the hormonal 'change' rather than the actual dose. You're obviously sensitive to the changes (me too).
You feeling chilled sounds very familiar. I can suddenly feel so chilled that I have to soak in a hot bath to warm up. I get headaches and nausea at the same time. It's hormones. Bloody hormones.
I think you have really been through the mill these last 6 months. I think you need a period of calm stability to give your body/mind time to convalesce. How about sticking with the 1/10 for the next few months, just so you can rest? I know the 2 week periods are a hassle but perhaps they're the lesser of two evils right now?
Glad you're feeling calmer. Keep us posted xxx
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Great post GRL x
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Thank you everyone for your advice and support, I have read everyone's input and you have all been so kind.
I wont write all your names as I do not want to leave anyone out!! But you have all made perfect sense and given good advice.
I am Knackered but Ok today as I have gone back to the 1/10 where I know that I am functioning ok even with the 2 week period which is the lesser of 2 evils!! (GRL)
I am much calmer today, and just taking it easy. I think it will take a couple of days to recover.
Why on earth the health professionals don't acknowledge that some people react badly to increased hormones I do not know!!
As well as the anxiety, I went from looking normal to really awful overnight - my friend said I looked rough. I cannot imagine myself into that if you know what I mean.
I obviously am very susceptible to hormones.
This I think explains why when I went on HRT the first time ( prempac c) which is a stronger HRT I was ok the first month and got more and more tired and zombie like by month 3 I was a jittery crying wreck and stopped. Therefore it seems to be the build up that effects me - as with the build up of the 2/10 femeston the other week which caused the same symptoms.
So it seems in conclusion that there may be some of us who aren't doing great on HRT and a suggested increase may not be the answer, and could increase symptoms and cause more problems. Incidentally I am better on 1/10 than off it .
I do feel emotionally and physically drained.
Isn't it scary ladies that we can feel like this? At least I can pin point the cause, but those of us who have it generally and randomly - OMG - dreadful.
So I am sticking to 1/10 and seeing how it goes.
Still a bit miffed with the meno nurse as she implied I was imagining my symptoms and I needed counselling. I have nothing against counselling etc but that's the same as saying that "this medication is causing you to have diarrhea , why not have some counselling to help!!"
Just because it is a mental symptom for want of a better description doesn't mean you have caused it!! Hilariously I did have diarrhea as well!!
Oh ladies what a roller coaster !!
I did curl up and watch TV condoms it is now !!
Thank you all again.
Peppermintyxx
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Pepperminty, I'm so sorry you are going through this hell, it does sounds frightening but don't worry, it won't last.
I doubt this is because of taking one pill but there is a slight chance you have suddenly developed an acute intolerance to progesterone. Do you know exactly what is in the pills i.e. ratio of oestrogen to progesterone? Is it worth running that idea past the meno nurse?
Sorry to bother you at a time like this but why have you gone from HRT to the pill?
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Hi Mary G,
I swopped because I was getting long periods and still exhausted and also for contraceptive purposes. If it worked it shuts down the peri symptoms - but is didn't for me unfortunately. My Gp thought it would work too.
Any way I am back on the low dose HRT and no longer a jabbering wreck, just knackered now!!
NO more BC Pills for me !
Sorry Sparkle - TV and condoms !! My meno brain too!!
Peppermintyxx
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Hi pepperminty - have been busy for a few days and only just logged on... so sorry to hear about this and how dare your meno nurse be anything other than sympathetic and listen to your concerns! As you say the CCP is not a normal ie bio-identical oestrogen - it is synthetic and I presume it's one of those with fixed amount of each so also high dose of synthetic progestogen?
No wonder you felt rough if you are sensitive to any of these. The equine oestrogens are also very strong so interesting that you felt the same on those.
I agree with the others - good that you are going back to the Femoston 1/10 - did you think of Qlaira though and if not why not - as the oestrogen at least is estradiol?
Anyway hope you are feeling better and just sending you :hug:
Hurdity x :)
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I too was thinking of Qlaira, but reasoned that you probably didn't even want to consider it after yesterday?
If at a later date you do want to think of alternatives, I think it could suit you. My biggest 'complaint' is the estrogen isn't strong enough for me. It would definitely reduce your bleeds and even though it's 2mg mainly (1 mg and nil on some days) this is bio identical, so different and less potent than what was in your pill.
I can fully understand if you don't even want to write the word 'pill' again, let alone take one, but it goes without saying that if you are interested, feel free to ask anything xx
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Hi Ladies,
I am much better , but a bit tired still and flat , but not surprising really.
Hurdity - I didn't think of Qlaira , to be honest as I have used the pill in the past with no problems and I didn't expect any reaction at all!! HA HA !! Thanks for the support ref the meno nurse, she gave the impression that I must be imagining the anxiety and upset stomach, nausea and headache and general feeling like death!!
Well ladies that explains it all then , we are all imagining our symptoms!! If I was feeling well I could have told her were to stick her suggestions!!
Briony- you are right the word pill now fills me with dread after that experience and I am going to stick with 1/10 femeton for a bit. My period appears to be finishing today - day 6 so hopefully no bits of spotting tomorrow !
I just wish I could feel less tired !! Still rather that than teary zombie!
Hope you are all coping well,
Peppermintyxxx
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Good to hear from you. Glad things are calmer :)
Have you ever had alook at the vaginal ring - Nuva Ring. It is meant to have fewer side effects than an oral BCP yet still controls your cycle. Not seen anyone on here use it for HRT, but hysterectomy site users seem to rate it. It's something I may consider but wish I knew more about it!
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Hi Briony,
No never thought of the vaginal ring, I must do some research! But I can't think that it would help with the meno as well as if it did surely it would be mentioned in some literature somewhere?
But to be honest I am a bit reticent at trying anything at the moment as I had such a nasty shock before!
I am on the new pack of HRT today so hopefully the oestrogen will kick in soon ( all be it the smaller dose!).
Hope you are faring ok ?
Peppermintyxx
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Apparently it's only be around in UK since 2009. More popular in France. Like you, I wonder why it's not more commonly suggested. Anyone?
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I think it does have side effects and the dose all though localised can still have side effects?
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Hi Briony and pepperminty
I think there is no reason why any one type of CCP would be suggested over another, if women decide to use this to regulate cycles in very early peri-menopause ( or late reproductive stage - eg when cycles become closer together, or when symptoms begin to appear) - because it is a contraceptive method rather than HRT. Qlaira would be an exception because it contains bio-identical oestrogen but still is not HRT! As you know many gynaes suggest remaining with the CCP in early peri to prevent menopausal symptoms, provided no risk factors ( because synthetic oestrogens are more risky to use health-wise). I seem to recall this was mentioned by Dr Currie in that DM article about use of HRT in peri?
However it sounds like it might be an idea for more to be known about this use of it in dealing with symptoms! The best way probably is to trawl forums but this is the main menopause one. Mumsnet might have some threads on the relevant board (ie not the menopause one which isn't used that much) - maybe where CCP is discussed? Not sure why women with hysterectomies would be using it particularly?
Sorry I can't help with specific Qs about the ring - I know nothing about it!
Hurdity x
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Hi Hurdity ,
thanks , I think that if the contraceptive pill is used to mask meno symptoms but it appears that starting it much earlier and carrying it on through your 40s would be the answer . Starting it later seems to open a can of worms, also the risk of any side effects are more in the first year of taking it. That increases as you get older.
I am definitely sticking to the HRT now. Although I am sooo tired. I seems odd that I fare better on one and a half tabs of oestrogen - one is not enough and 2 is too much!!
Do you think when I go back in 4 months for my check up I could request the GEL to top me up on top of the tablets when and if I need it as getting extra packets and splitting the oestrogen tabs in half seems a faff.
Peppermintyxx
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I think topping up with the gel as and when you need it iscan excellent idea PM.
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Yes sounds like a good idea. The main thing though would be to make sure you have enough progestogen to oppose any extra oestrogen you are taking so that your womb lining doesn't over thicken?
Hurdity x
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Hi Hurdity ,
I suppose that I would have to find out the equivalent of what a half a Femosten 1/10 tablet is in oestrogen in gel oestrogen form if that makes sense. As I just need a little extra it seems not twice the amount. I bet the nurse wont agree to it and makes me change type , which I am worried about as I don't want to start changing in case it goes more tits up again !!
The only problem I have is exhaustion, where I have trouble speaking I am so tired !
pepperminty xx
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As if I didn't need any more confirmation , I took one 2/10 femosten tablet 2 days ago as I was one oestrogen tablet on the femoten 1/10 in the pack short , so I thought rather than waste a pack or miss a pill I would just replace/substitute it.
Well the next day even though I slept like a log I looked and felt awful again , not as bad as if I had taken a few days worth as before , but definitely more foggy and exhausted , therefor I can again only conclude that more oestrogen does not agree with me. Am I weird?
peppermintyxx xx
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A sudden increase in oestrogen can cause side effects in some women - but the side effects usually settle ( like in pregnancy when levels are very high). It might be that increasing the dose of transdermal HRT would have less of an effect. With tablets you have to take quite a large dose in order to get a certain level in the bloodstream - as so much is metabolised by the liver - and it could be this that is disagreeing with you rather than taking more oestrogen per se .
You're not weird!!! You feel what you feel!!!
Hurdity x :)
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Hi pepperminty.
I like you have tried prempak C, and I felt awful on it, tired, exhausted, headaches, nausea, then I tried cyclo-prognova and the same thing happened. Im now trying the patches and feel so much better.
Hang in there I hope you find something that helps you. :)
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Hi Thanks Hurdity and Robotwars,
I think that is a very valid point about the sudden surge needing to be higher in tablet form. I am ok on 1/10 , but still feel very tired and achy and have meno foggy brain, But at least my moods are better- no panic ( well obviously a bit now and again , but I can cope a lot better) no tears and terror!
I have to stay on the Femosten 1/10 for 4 months until I see the meno nurse again and if I haven't had an improvement in tiredness and brain fog , aches and periods - although my last one was 6 days , so that was better than 10 days, I will perhaps suggest patches,
I do not know diddly squat about the best patches to use? I don't want any ones with man made progesterone , something with the same progesterone as the femosten - or utrogestan .
Dr Currie suggested well over a year ago try thr Femosten and if that doesn't work try:
For the estrogen, take 1mg Elleste solo daily.
For the progestogen, take Utrogestan 200mg taken daily by tablet at bedtime for 12 days per 28 day cycle. Utrogestan should be taken at bedtime because it may cause some sleepiness
But what is Estelle solo? Is it a tablet? Wouldn't I be better off on a patch?
If you are on the patch does it have the progesterone in the patch for 12 days or does the progesterone come in tablet form and you take it as well as the patch?
Is there one that suits most in patch form as with the Femeston ( tablet) which is kinder and suits more women?
Glad I am not weird!!
Pepperminty?
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I take evorel sequi, so I have 2 weeks of patches without progesterone then for the next 2 weeks I have patches with the progesterone in them, you change the patches twice a week and they stick really well!
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Pepperminty, you can take patches without Progesterone and then have that separately (ie in bio identical form,). If you have the estrogen only patches, they are much of a likeness, the key differences being size and stickability. I had no problems with Evorel. Have you considered taking a gel? Knowing you are very sensitive to estrogen, at least you could alter the dose on a day by day basis?
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Hi pepperminty.
I like you have tried prempak C, and I felt awful on it, tired, exhausted, headaches, nausea, then I tried cyclo-prognova and the same thing happened. Im now trying the patches and feel so much better.
Hang in there I hope you find something that helps you. :)
Robotwars, what patch dose are you on? x
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Evorel 50
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Hi pepperminty
Have you managed to find out all the differences with the different products yet?
Elleste solo is an oestrogen only tablet. Some women who prefer to use oral but bio-identical HRT take this with separate progesterone (Utrogestan) as Dr Currie suggested.
Progesterone (the bio-identical one) cannot be produced in a patch. For oral use it is micronised ( ground up very finely) and prepared in a suspension (liquid) and put into the Utrogestan capsules. As has been discussed before the closest progesterone to our own is dydrogesterone - the progestogen in Femoston, and the least androgenic (ie least testosterone related).
This is why those of us who want to use patches but want to use bio-identical products have to take them separately.
It is worth noting that with the combi patches, and with Femoston, the progestogen part is for the full 14 days, whereas the stronger progestogens are only taken for 12 days per cycle. This means that in a 4 week cycle women who are progesterone intolerant may well experience adverse symptoms for more than 2 weeks - longer than in a normal menstrual cycle, ie the two weeks of the progestogen and then the few days progesterone withdrawal before the bleed and maybe the first couple of days. This is why some gynaes recommend a longer cycle under supervision for such women.
I hope I haven't confused you? My brain doesn't seem to produce words in the same way that it used to and I just type things as they occur to me so sometimes might come across garbled!!
I use Estradot 50 because they are very small.
Hurdity x
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I know this is an old post but just wanted to comment about this reaction to starting the pill in case others, like me, are reading old posts for advice.
I too had the extreme reaction when I went back on the pill (after being fine on it 6 years earlier). I already had bad nausea up to midday but for the first 7-8 days of the pill I had it from 5am to 6pm, so all day and so intense I had to cling onto the bed to get through the unbearable waves, plus the intense waves of fear and could only cope with milk and juice that week. I knew the pill would initially increase symptoms though, as you are adding to surges at that stage, and that once the hormones had built up to lower the surges it would get better which it did.
The nausea never returned, so if anyone has the same extreme reaction, it does change dramatically after the first week - if you can hang in! You can also take a beta blocker for the anxiety surges and a sleep inducing antihistamine like Cyclizine for the nausea surges. (Don't take Motilium or ginger as they are stimulating and make it much worse!).
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:thankyou: danger mouse - I have never been able to over-ride any medication which makes me nauseous :-\