Menopause Matters Forum
Menopause Discussion => All things menopause => Topic started by: Briony on August 24, 2015, 11:40:58 AM
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Came across this by accident, whilst looking for something on high dose patches ( - that's for another thread ::))
I don't always believe what I read, but this seems to be from a reputable source and, importantly, is very up to date. Interesting that they refer to progesterone taken vaginally - something some of our doctors don't usually acknowledge. There is also a clear emphasis on patients' views too, which is intersting. It feels quite balanced.
(Author is a member of British Menopause Society Medical Advisory Council).
http://www.rcgp.org.uk/courses-and-events/one-day-essentials/~/media/Files/Events/Business-Development-Team/ODEs/Womens%20Health%202015/Dr-Jane-Woyka-PPT.ashx
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very interesting reading, love the illustrations too. Makes me very annoyed though that I was not diagnosed 3 years ago when I first started complaining of insomnia, as its the first symptom mentioned - GP had no interest at all. >:(
great info on HRT for those concerned.
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My thoughts exactly. My previous GP thought anti depressants were the answer to everything and hot flushes were the only sign of low estrogen. Luckily I eventually got the confidence to move to a different practice. Strongly recommend you do the same if yours isn't supportive. Look for one with DOCCOG qualification if you can xxx
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this is my second GP change Briony, no worries if I get no joy from the lady GP I am visiting on Wednesday I will change again, but I am quite hopeful as the nurse tells me she is very good in the meno field.
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That's good news. Fingers crossed for Wednesday. Let us know how you get on xxx
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I get so infuriated when emphasis is only put on the "better known" meno symptom of hot flushes. If they refer to insomnia at all, they usually say something like "sleep disturbances" or "sleep disruptions" as if it's just a minor inability to fall asleep or stay asleep.
No let's call it what it really is - bone crushing, anxiety filled, depression laden, life altering, chronic insomnia - the total inability to fall sleep no matter what you do. That's what I had anyway. I would have cheerfully swapped all other meno symptoms for just being able to fall sleep without having to toss and turn for hours on end every night.
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I feel the same.
After my hysterectomy I found it really difficult to sleep. Never had a problem before. It was instant!
When I got settled on HRT I could sleep again. Now I am menopausal again I can't!
GPs really don't get it at all!
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I saw 2 female GPs (both in their 50s) who knew very little about the menopause.
Both dismissed my thoughts that my symptoms might be hormone related, because I wasn't suffering with hot flushes and because 'I was 10 years too young' apparently.
They continued to ignore my concerns despite me telling them that very early menopause runs in the family, and that I have a very definite history of PMS and PND, which are both big indications that peri menopausal anxiety and depression could be a problem.
If I think about it too much I could cry. Because I lost over a year of my life thanks to being misdiagnosed and incorrectly treated with ADs. Just like I lost over a year of my life to PND.
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I'm the same. They were happy to do MRIs, brain scans and dish out ADs, but refused to even consider testing my estrogen or FSH because of my age and lack of hot flushes. Hopefully, over time, things will improve for people like us. At least , for example, if GPs read this they will at least then acknowledge vaginal progesterone and know what Utrogestan is. X
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Dana - I might just use that description of the insomnia tomorrow, that just about sums it up.
StellaJane, LOL - yes I loved the illustrations.
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Dana - I might just use that description of the insomnia tomorrow, that just about sums it up.
StellaJane, LOL - yes I loved the illustrations.
Be my guest :)
I think the problem is that if you have never suffered REAL insomnia you just have no idea how debilitating it really is, and that's the problem with some doctors. I would have preferred to have just had the hot flushes as long as I was still able to sleep. I wouldn't have cared if I they woke me up a few times through the night - as they have done - I just needed to be able to fall asleep.
Everyone has a night or two here or there of not being able to sleep, so they think that's all it is, a minor inconvenience, but at one stage I went for 3 nights straight without any sleep at all and my brain was totally fried. It's indescribable to anyone who hasn't experienced it. It's no wonder that withholding sleep from someone has been used as a form of torture.
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:thankyou: Thanks for posting that presentation Briony - it's an excellent summary of everything, all in one place! Have downloaded it...
Hurdity x
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Glad it's of use :) x
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Totally agree that insomnia can crucify you.
The first time I experienced a while night with genuinely zero sleep I thought I was having a major mental illness episode.
My mind felt like it had been scoured out with bleech and left raw and exposed. I felt wired and strung out. The next day I felt physically queasy and my head was throbbing in pain. My hands 'felt' like they had a tremor though they weren't visibly shaking. I had diarrhoea and couldn't face eating. I feel confused and emotionally very vulnerable and near tears all day.
I avoid driving because I feel so uncoordinated and slightly out of control. It totally wreaks my day.
It takes me 48 hours at least to recover.
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GypsyRoseLee - your description of missing a nights sleep was exactly how I felt when meno symptoms kicked in. I could barely function for months and was truly awful. I now sleep with hrt but am 57 and worried as doctor murmuring about coming off!!!!
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I think the early episodes of insomnia I had were possibly the worst part of peri menopause.
I have always been able to sleep no matter what. For that to suddenly change was frankly terrifying. I don't know about others but actual 'fear' was a very real part of my insomnia. Fear of what was happening, fear of why it was happening, fear if how wretched I would feel the next day.
If I had to use one adjective to comprehensively describe my peri menopause experience I think it would be 'fear'.
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GypsyRoseLee - your description of missing a nights sleep was exactly how I felt when meno symptoms kicked in. I could barely function for months and was truly awful. I now sleep with hrt but am 57 and worried as doctor murmuring about coming off!!!!
That was exactly the description of my insomnia, except mine was multiplied by 3 nights of totally no sleep. HRT was my saviour as well, and I also now have my backups of the occasional dose of doxylamine or Endep (amitriptyline AD) to help out with those odd nights when sleep just won't come.
I have a morbid fear of what will happen when/if I have to come off HRT too. I'm 56, and my doctor is pretty lenient about HRT, but I'm not sure that I want to stay on it for the rest of my life anyway. Continuous progesterone is an issue for me, so even just the thought of periods for the next 10-20 odd years is troubling.
I have recently tried to cut a small amount of my patch to see if I could at least get down to a low dose, and it didn't go well, so I think that for the time being I will have to stay on a medium HRT. Maybe I'll try again when I'm closer to 60. Maybe by then my body will have adapted to menopause a little better.
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Hi Dana
I had nights with no sleep and felt it was like torture, however tired I was my brain seemed wired up. Do still have odd nights with disturbed sleep but nothing like it was, like you I'm hoping my body will adjust as I go towards 60 - here's hoping!
Lesley