Menopause Matters Forum
Menopause Discussion => All things menopause => Topic started by: mandy43 on June 02, 2015, 07:47:34 PM
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Well, I finally got the result of the smear and all is normal!!! As a treat for my birthday and this good news hubby took me to Spain for the weekend... should have been great and then on Sunday I go to the toilet and blood everywhere... thought it was my periods, but no it's coming from my bum (tmi). So, it totally spoilt everything, as all I have done is worry. Now, the poor guy had to check for me where it was coming from and he said my piles inside had burst... and although I have suffered with piles since having the kids I have never bled like this. I had it Monday exactly the same and today I got an emergency appt at Docs and she said it is internal piles. However, I don't believe it. I can't go the toilet for a No2 without all this blood, it's freaking me out. On top of that I have had heartburn since yesterday and it's like fire when anything goes down. I think I'm dying and everything is related. I can't take anyones word for it. I need to go the loo now but I won't as I don't want to see that blood again. Has anyone had piles that have bled like a blood bath and if so when will it stop. It's only like that if I use the loo, not coming out any other time. Again, sorry for treating this place like a therapy couch, but my family are sick of me!!
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You poor thing that sounds awful. I know piles can be troublesome. Don't worry about treating the forum like a therapy couch. That is what it is for.
Best wishes and hugs
Sallyxx
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Mandy I've had piles in the past but they've been external but still very uncomfortable. Did the Dr give you anything to help?
I've taken anusol suppositories in the past which have helped - you can get them from any pharmacy.
I wouldn't hold back from going to the toilet because if you do, more fluid is likely to be absorbed from the fecal matter you are trying to pass - so then it will be dryer and harder to pass and I would think more painful to pass.
When I had issues with piles the doctor prescribed me Fibrogel - and it made my poo large and soft to pass! (TMI!). But it made the whole process less painful and it did clear up.
I'm not a medic but, the thing that comes to mind is to try to eat high fibre foods (prunes, milled flax on yogurt or porridge) and any fibre supplements the Dr has given you - drink lots of water so that there's plenty of fluid in your diet to keep fecal matter moist and try not to freak out when you see red blood in the loo. Hopefully, if you follow whatever advice you were given by the Dr, things will settle down.
Also get yourself some really nice soft moist toilet paper wipes - so that it's not painful when you're wiping down there.
Remind yourself when you see blood that the doctor said it's piles. As far as I'm aware, you cannot die from piles. So just keep reminding yourself of that - sending hugs xxx
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Large amounts of blood are usually from burst piles, maybe think that you are basically bursting a vein and this might make it easier to realise how you get so much blood! I assume the blood is bright red as well?
Constipation is the enemy of piles as the hard stools will make them bleed more so keep them as soft as you can as has been said.
If the bleeding continues day after day then do see your Dr as you can get veyr anaemic from it and this needs keeping an eye on and they can if necessary do something about it as well.
The heartburn could be from all your anxiety and stress - spoon the gaviscon liquid in and it should help settle it down.
I understand totally your panic and fear but remember its almost certainly internal piles.
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I have had this. Mine are mostly external though. Once on getting up from the loo mine burst and I had blood all over the floor and my clothes. I nearly died of shock. Took my self off to the GP who said it was piles. It's happened a few times to be honest but that was the very worse.
The worst thing you can do is not open your bowels. As the others have said, drink plenty and up your fibre if your constipated.
I have IBS, the D kind and that is just as bad for piles believe it or not.
Did the GP give you any treatement. If not then get some suppositories to sooth things.
Honeybun
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Thanks girls! The doc gave me suppositories. On the Sunday I had really lose bowels and was on the toilet most of the day and then that night is when the bleeding started... so not constipated. Can I ask the ladies who have had this, how long do I expect this bleeding to go on before it dries up?
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It all depends how quick you heal up. Keep using your suppositories and don't avoid going to the toilet when you need to.
At least you know what it is and although unpleasant it's pretty harmless. Also a little blood looks a lot when it's in water.
Honeybun
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Oh you poor thing, how distressing to have this happen straight after the stress of the smear - glad that it was clear and there are lovely ladies here advising you on the current situation. Hope things settle for you soon and you can have some respite x
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Honeybun my hubby said just go if you need to but don't look in the toilet, but I'm not sure if that is a good idea as I think I should be monitoring if it's getting better? I've been using ointment internally yesterday and today the suppositories and doc said should be about a week, but my lord I would be anaemic if this went on for a week. thanks Brightlight, I really do want a break from all the shocks!
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You poor thing :-(
My son age 20 was bleeding when going no2, GP gave him suppositories and told him if bleeding stops within one week then it's piles, if not it'd need more investigation. It cleared within that week
Good luck, I do hope you get it sorted
Annie xx
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Blood goes a long way ::) especially if wind assisted. Bright red blood is fresh, it's when it is darker or black that 1 needs to worry. Use what your GP has prescribed. Drink plenty and eat well. He may suggest 24 hours to allow any veins to heal however, once the bowel is active again it may cause tiny tares (sp). tears :-\
Such a shock!
All that worry and the smear is OK and now, on your weekend away, :-X
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I was given Sheriproct suppositories, not sure of their ingredients. My No2 is normal colour but loose, so hopefully not coming from anywhere higher. Problem is when I go the loo my bum always turns inside out, so I have always had very bad piles but they never bothered me, only after I had a child, but never alot of blood only a little when I wiped occasionally. I have upped my veg intake and water but I'm sooo frightened to go the loo again. I know if I see all that blood again I will automatically presume the worst as surely it should have stopped by now if it was just a burst pile, otherwise where is all the blood coming from?
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Mandy, think how long a cut on your skin takes to heal - and then remember that this particular cut is in very thin skin, in a moist place, on a muscle which moves, and with damp moist stuff moving past it and pushing clots or scabs off it. I think it would take longer to heal than an injury you could see. I'd suggest not looking for say three days and then you will be pleasantly surprised.
One of babies had a little cut which opened every time he filled his nappy and there was bleeding - it was almost impossible to get rid of until a health visitor suggested vaseline on his bottom - which made everything slide out much easier - but it still took a while to heal up.
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thanks Ancient runner, I never thought of it like that... I will take your advice and from all the other lovely ladies. I have always been a worrier, but at this particular time, I am worse than ever and just not coping. :'(
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Mandy,
Sounds so uncomfortable. Can you do some form of mindfulness/meditation to reduce your anxiety? Might help you to cope a bit better. Sending hugs. Xx
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I know how you feel Mandy, I've had months of worrying about little things and jump at every new symptom. But right now I haven't got that particular symptom - even though there are health things I probably should worry about (got to have an MRI in a couple of weeks) and it's glorious. Like something has been switched off in my head. I am not sure if my hormones are currently behaving or if I've just got very good at firmly igoring worries.
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I will try to relax but it's hard in this house. Ancient Runner, What us your MRI for, I do hope all goes well. I had a panic attack inside one of them machines, see I'm useless. I can't get rid of this heartburn either, so I'm tossing between what is causing this and what is causing this and is it all interlinked... I'm driving myself mad!!
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Mandy, I have this problem, worse for me sometimes as I am on blood thinners. You must keep going or you will end up straining and make the bleeding worse.
Piles are enlarged blood vessels but it the doc has seen it, believe her. Use the suppositories and they should shrink, remember they don't go, but if you dont strain they should be ok.
When my anxiety is high I just done look. I wipe without checking the paper, then shut the lid with my eyes shut before flushing.
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I've frightened myself silly now though, as i have just googled the difference between piles and colon cancer and there really isn't any difference in symptoms. I thought colon cancer blood was dark, but no, read loads of case studies and the majority said they went the loo and it was full of bright red blood and how the doc told them it was piles and then later down the line they found out it was bowel cancer? I just want to cry, i can't take this anymore. Before I went away I had the worry of cervical cancer and I was desperately and still am, tired all the time and thought it was due to cervical cancer, now I'm thinking all the stomach issues I have had for years and the tiredeness and now this blood are due to bowel cancer. I'm going to have to go private again. Please if any of you have had piles have you had it where you just go the loo and then all of a sudden there is loads of blood down the loo?
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You've been told how other ladies with piles have seen blood and still you google :-\ - you've been to a Dr and been given treatment and still you google :-\ …….
I doubt if many people who went on to develop colon/bowel cancer had fresh blood in the pan. Both areas of the body are higher up the intestinal tract working from the anus upwards ……… so it takes longer for blood to be passed from those areas. Which sites did you GOOGLE, NHS or another one 'out there' which isn't medic based?
Why go private, why not ring your Practice Nurse/GP and ask for reassurance: along the lines of "I wasn't listening properly at my last visit, could you remind me ……… "
Are you still bleeding? Remember, what you see seems a lot but in fact, once the pile has popped, the remaining bleed is likely to be from any scab/scarring ……… as you pass the next motion. A little blood goes a long way!
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It was one of those ones with NHS stories and it honestly stated my symptoms CLKD. I don't know if it still there the same as yesterday as I won't go the loo for a no2... I asked the doc how long will it last and she said give it a week but she didn't really want to put a time limit on it as she didn't want to worry me if it went on longer but it was just so out of the blue that it has really scared me.
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You really need to stop looking on the Internet as its full of scare stories.
Why would your GP take a look and say it was piles if she could not see anything.
As I said, I have had a toilet pan full of blood....a little goes a long way....also on the floor and running down my legs.
As for not going to the loo.....you know from what everyone has said that's so not going to help and can also make you feel unwell.
Now you have had your kick up the bum so now have a :bighug: trust your GP and use your medication, go to the loo and allow your body time to get better.
It's piles.
My mother who is 92 complains constantly. As I've told her numerous times....no one has died of piles.
Honeybun
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you truly are a honeybun, thanks so much xx
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:kick: I can never understand why anyone who has visited their GP and not been fobbed off; who asks for advice on a Forum and then looks at 'google' or other sites …….. we are 'real' on here, some of those people on sites really, truly, are not: some are on those other sites put stuff out there with absolutely no knowledge at all ::)
Don't you trust us :'(
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I don't understand either CLKD?
I would assume the GP will have seen hundreds of cases of piles in their time? There's no reason why they haven't made a completely accurate diagnosis?
And to deliberately refrain from having a bowel movement is just self sabotaging and is only going to make the situation worse.
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Mandy can I suggest something?
While you're anxious (which is completely understandable) try to avoid activities that increase your anxiety - so avoid googling health issues around the bowels - before you do something like that, ask yourself is this going to increase or decrease my anxiety? If it's going to increase it - choose something else - or, ask yourself is this helpful for me to do at this moment? And answer it honestly.
And just for the sake of argument, if it was the worst possible thing you thought it might be (eg cancer) one week isn't going to make any difference in terms of treatment outcomes - SO give yourself a week where you just focus on it being piles and deal with the symptoms as best you can. If they persist after a week - then go back and see the Dr again.
So think about not looking in the pan. Being extra kind to your backside when you go. Keep going - if you avoid going, it's going to take more time to heal because the harder fecal matter will dig into the piles area. And eat lots of food which makes your poo sloppy - then it will be less strain to evacuate even if it's sloppier than normal.
When you find yourself worrying - do something to distract yourself. List things you can do as distractions and practice being really present with the distraction for at least 5 minutes before you go back to worrying.
Try to do some relaxation exercises as well. That will help your body calm down a bit. Even a 5 minute walk around the block - and also practice really looking around and identifying things to focus on in order to give your mind some distraction.
Remember the more you focus on thinking the worst - the more your mind is going to go there - it's like digging a groove in the brain - it just gets deeper and deeper. You need to walk a different path in terms of your thought patterns.
You can do it! It's not easy but the more you practice, the easier it will become.
Sending hugs xxx
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thank you Greenfields! I truly understand what everyone is telling me, on here and at home, but I find it so hard to not think negatively. I have been the toilet and there is still blood in the toilet, so that has sent me plumetting yet again. sorry to everyone for rambling on about this, just imagine how my family feel. I will keep going with treatment the doc gave and see how I am by the weekend.
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Mandy I had piles when pregnant. The bleeding came and went for weeks. So don't expect a fast cessation to the bleeding I'm afraid.
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thank you Greenfields! I truly understand what everyone is telling me, on here and at home, but I find it so hard to not think negatively. I have been the toilet and there is still blood in the toilet, so that has sent me plumetting yet again. sorry to everyone for rambling on about this, just imagine how my family feel. I will keep going with treatment the doc gave and see how I am by the weekend.
When you feel the urge to google, google ways to reduce your anxiety!
Here's one link: http://speakoutblog.ca/2015/05/12/my-anxiety-tool-kit/
Sending hugs.
xxx
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What would you have done before owning a computer :-\ …….. go along to your GP!
Bleeding is natural. Unpleasant but as mentioned, one doesn't die from piles. What seems to be a lot of blood is usually not, it's the shock effect that is so awful.
I know how easy it is to be stuck in a thought pattern, as a recovering anorexic it is very difficult to move forwards. Make a list of what your GP has suggested, how bad your symptoms are, tick off when you do a pooh which is essential or you really WILL have problems :poke2: and use the medication as prescribed. Otherwise you really won't heal!
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Hi Mandy
Print out the guidance Greenfield has given you, those are great steps to help manage your anxiety. Try not to expect the bleeding to stop imediately and try not to associate this continuing as a sign something is very wrong. Try not to link them together, try to remember that piles bleed, that is what is happening. Anxiety getting overwhelming is in some ways a seperate thing but it's got in a loop.
I do understand and can only support confidently because I really do xxx
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Hello Mandy - couple of thoughts. As I said before, know where you are coming from with anxiety. First thing is DON'T GOOGLE. You'll always find the worst possibility, plus people on the sites or talking about the symptoms are either worried well, newly diagnosed - or really seriously ill with something. The people who get treated and get on with their lives simply aren't there. Second thing - when I did drive myself nuts- I had some counselling that I think was CBT. Tactic was to simply not think about things you can't change. Imagine a chest of drawers in your head, and every time your brain tries to tell you your piles are fatal, slam that thought in the drawer and ignore it. Do something else. It is easier said than done - but it does get easier to do.
So - no peeping down the loo. No google. And please try to put the obsessive thoughts away as soon as they appear. xx
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only just seen these new replies and I am trying. However, I went the loo first thing and I looked and it was full of blood, fear and panic set in again and I took myself off to A and E. I had to! I saw a wonderful doctor who understood my nervous state. Bloods were done and my blood pressure was through the roof. he examined my stomach, back etc and then my bottom. He said I have 2 cuts inside me and I asked him about the bowel cancer. He said no, the bleeding is coming from the cuts. However, I should get myself referred to have as sigmoid or colonoscopy as the fear is going to do me more harm than anything. He said I should get it done and put it to bed. If I need treatment for the piles then just get it out of the way. He was very caring and understanding. But can I tell you and please don't get annoyed with me, but my first thought was, 'well if there is nothing wrong with me, why does he want me to be referred?' Even though he explained to me numerous times what I said above, I was and am still questioning why he said it. Second thing is, why all the blood out of a few tears? Again he explained that the blood splash effect in the toilet is typical piles. Yet, still I question this. Next, my FBC came back normal and he told me that the other results for liver, kidneys etc... aren't back yet but if there was anything wrong with them, my fbc would have been out of whack. Yet still I am fearing the phone ringing or a letter coming in the post to say the doc wants to see me. I truly believe there is no helping me. I won't believe anyone, what the hell is wrong with me?
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oh thanks Sparkle. I do think all the worry does come from a good place, the need to be fit and healthy for my children... but I just wish I could believe what doctors tell me without having to run to a specialist at the quickest opportunity and usually privately, so it is quick, to finally put it to rest.
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So it's piles ::) just like your GP told you.
The reason you bleed it that when you go to the loo you are forcing open what amounts to a cut in a very sensitive area. That takes time to heal up.
Sounds to me as if the doctor only suggested further investigation to put your your mind at rest because you had got upset and stressed.
Why don't you sit back for a week or so before you even consider having an investigation done as probably by then you will be better.
Keeping your feet up helps piles as does a warm bath.
Honeybun
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thanks honeybun will try xx
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You don't want to believe what sounds to be a very good A&E Senior Houseofficer/Registrar, caring, kind, knowledgeable: who is busy ……. what do you want anyone to say? He seems to have taken on board your health concerns, took bloods which came back 'within normal limits' and yep, the other tests can take up to 10 days. Gave you time. I can feel his empathy from here ;)
"However, I should get myself referred to have as sigmoid or colonoscopy as the fear is going to do me more harm than anything. He said I should get it done and put it to bed. If I need treatment for the piles then just get it out of the way. He was very caring and understanding. But can I tell you and please don't get annoyed with me, but my first thought was, 'well if there is nothing wrong with me ……. " you aren't listening ::) - how did you feel whilst he was examining you, how did you feel when he said the above?
If it's piles then they will take time to heal. I think you need to return to your GP for advice, taking on board that he/she will know what he/she is talking about and *take on board* what you are told. Actually: what's the worst it could be?
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I felt huge relief CLKD, but as usual it is always short relief, as I always need to have that final test done to rule at the big C. That;s what I am scared of and have been since I was a teenager. I'm not going back the doc again, as I know it won't make me any better. I am due to the see my meno specialist next Thursday, so I will ask if he can refer me to have the sigmoidoscopy and take it from there. I cannot thank everyone on here enough for listening, understanding, the tough love, the empathy. Believe me I do feel better when I read all the replies and it does help, if only in the short-term, it makes me feel better at my low points.
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Mandy have you thought about having CBT? It would really help with breaking the repetitive thought patterns and would be good for your anxiety long term. You can get it for free by telephone - it's called ITalk - worth looking into if you haven't already tried it.
Hugs xxx
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You certainly need psychological assistance.
Your Meno Specialist is unlikely to refer you, it would be unethical. The least he should be able to do is make the suggest to your GP, so you may as well bite the bullet and go to your GP. Otherwise you have another week of worrying :-\
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Mandy can I suggest something?
While you're anxious (which is completely understandable) try to avoid activities that increase your anxiety - so avoid googling health issues around the bowels - before you do something like that, ask yourself is this going to increase or decrease my anxiety? If it's going to increase it - choose something else - or, ask yourself is this helpful for me to do at this moment? And answer it honestly.
And just for the sake of argument, if it was the worst possible thing you thought it might be (eg cancer) one week isn't going to make any difference in terms of treatment outcomes - SO give yourself a week where you just focus on it being piles and deal with the symptoms as best you can. If they persist after a week - then go back and see the Dr again.
So think about not looking in the pan. Being extra kind to your backside when you go. Keep going - if you avoid going, it's going to take more time to heal because the harder fecal matter will dig into the piles area. And eat lots of food which makes your poo sloppy - then it will be less strain to evacuate even if it's sloppier than normal.
When you find yourself worrying - do something to distract yourself. List things you can do as distractions and practice being really present with the distraction for at least 5 minutes before you go back to worrying.
Try to do some relaxation exercises as well. That will help your body calm down a bit. Even a 5 minute walk around the block - and also practice really looking around and identifying things to focus on in order to give your mind some distraction.
Remember the more you focus on thinking the worst - the more your mind is going to go there - it's like digging a groove in the brain - it just gets deeper and deeper. You need to walk a different path in terms of your thought patterns.
You can do it! It's not easy but the more you practice, the easier it will become.
Sending hugs xxx
Oh Mandy - your worries must be causing you a lot of distress - keep reading the above, it will help. I know that it is very hard to challenge thinking when you 'think' it is protecting you.
The truth is I could have cancer right now and not know, you could, anyone could......the point I am making is that sometimes testing isn't the best way to manage health anxiety. Your mind might be put to rest with further investigation due to your fear of cancer or it might not. I'd wait a week or so until the current problem eases before you make your mind up. Meanwhile you can try to stop the anxiety in it's tracks now, you have something to work with, the piles. Once you start to make progress challenging the irrational thoughts or at least calming yourself, you will gain confidence and it will become easier to assess your health and deal with health issues in a lighter more easeful way.
Take care x
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Make that list - jot down what your GP has told you and what the SHO/Registrar discussed with you. All positive. All wounds take time to heal and it takes longer if there is pressure because any irritation on thin skin will aggravate the area.
Read the list - many years ago I accepted to do a talk as soon as I put down the 'phone I thought "What have I done!". It was a subject I am passionate about so I made a list of what I would say, who I was talking to and how much about the subject they would be familiar with. I wrote out a basic 'talk' and read it every day for the next 3 months until I could read it without that awful gut fluttering. I was nervous on the afternoon of the talk but it went really well 8)
By looking at the notes I had made it enabled me. It wasn't easy. Those fear symptoms made me almost cancel several times but by reading the list daily I began to gain confidence: until ;)
Oh don't go, we need to know how you are! I can deal with situations if I don't have time to think about them, it's after - once the adrenaline drops off, that reaction sets in :-\ …….. if I am asked to do something that gives me time to consider it, then my anxiety kicks in: what if ….. bugger it
I had cancer. I'm still here >wave< ! I have a wound as well as marks where the radiation was lined up but I never think about it, don't even look at the marks ….
I did use relaxation therapy for several years. Starting at my toes, stretching hard and relaxing - all the muscle groups up my body, the idea being that whilst concentrating on that my brain would be focussed off my panic - well >shrug<. Try it, then let us know in the morning ;)
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I will ladies. I'm going to try to do some relaxation therapy now. CLKD, I know I am strong in many ways, have had to deal with some very hard points in my life; losing my baby, my dad, my brother and I'm still standing. And, I know what you have been through, from other posts I have read, you are incredibly strong and I will go the docs, as I don't need him or her to reassure me again now, I will just asked to be referred and try to put this to bed. I also think I will ask about doing CBT again, i need to get some control. ni night ladies xx
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Not sure I understand why you need a referral. Surely sticking a big tube up your bum will make things worse and not better.
Are you going privately or NHS.
You have piles. I do sympathise but surely after being seen by a doctor at the hospital is reassurance enough rather than an unnecessary test.
Honeybun
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Let us know how you get on with the relaxation. Do you like music, I found on the nights I was unable to sleep that radio 2 music enabled me to pretend I was skating: Oh I was SO good ;D : I found that the planning of moves helped me relax >shrug< …… practicing my relaxation therapy was the hardest for me, stopping the racing thoughts, trying to relax when my whole body was 'on the go' ……..
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Yes I guess so. I guess it's because I'm a coward and run a mile from any tests.
Its all down to the individual and if it gives reassurance then it would be the right thing to do.
Sorry.
Honeyb
x
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Honeybun I hate tests too! Honestly, until I went into the meno, I wouldn't go near a doc, as I'm frightened of everything as well. I really appreciated your response, as I really need people to tell me to pull myself together and accept what I've been told. Equally, Sparkle is on the same page as me as well, I will probably worry everytime I see blood in the toilet, if it's piles or something more in the future if I don 't have it done. CLKD, I went the loo this morning and when I saw blood I just repeated in my head what the doc said: 'You have a cut at 5 o'clock and at 7 o'clock' (Apparently they see the inside of a bum as a clockface haha). I feel really calm at the moment and I'm just going to allow my body to heal, accept that there will be blood until it heals and wait until I go back my GP next week and see about the referral. Although, I'm not sure if the A and E doc has already written to the doc and suggested this anyway, as he seemed quite adamant that I have it done and get rid of all the piles I have.
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How do you feel! chuffed hopefully! Half an hour at a time :-\ …….. you will get there and yep, the clock-face is used in many medical situations ;D
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baby steps at 45 CLKD ;D
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CLKD, I went the loo this morning and when I saw blood I just repeated in my head what the doc said: 'You have a cut at 5 o'clock and at 7 o'clock' (Apparently they see the inside of a bum as a clockface haha). I feel really calm at the moment and I'm just going to allow my body to heal, accept that there will be blood until it heals and wait until I go back my GP next week and see about the referral. Although, I'm not sure if the A and E doc has already written to the doc and suggested this anyway, as he seemed quite adamant that I have it done and get rid of all the piles I have.
Mandy that's fantastic reframing of your thoughts! - you go girl!! Just keep practising that type of thought reframing of the situation and you will start to feel more in control of the situation and less anxious - I hope things continue to improve.
Hugs xxx
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Any improvement? I keep wondering how you are?