Menopause Matters Forum
Menopause Discussion => All things menopause => Topic started by: Ljp on October 29, 2014, 08:51:32 AM
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Hi, I have just turned 50, and I have been peri menopausal for approx 5 years, periods are very few and light, not had anything now since August.
I have been managing my horrible symptoms quite well by using serenity cream, and St johns wort etc.
More recently I am noticing other symptoms arsing which I'm struggling to ease, the night sweats are real bad, day flushes aren't really too much of a problem, as not as often. Also my hair is really changing in texture, I know I would have a large proportion of grey if I didn't colour it and that grey hair can be course.
I am finding the mood swings and general feelings of doom and gloom more difficult, I have days when its difficult to even want to talk, I feel so sorry for my husband, as I am horrible at times and this just makes me feel less like opening my mouth for fear the fire breathing dragon will raise its ugly head.
I am terrified of HRT as I am terrified of cancer. I am considering stopping the serenity cream as not feeling it's doing much for me now, although it has helped for a few years. I know they do a cream called 20-1 which has the addition of some oestrogen but again I am very scared of using it, even the serenity cream plays with my mind, making me question is it right to play with Hormones?
Do any of you use supplements? If so what have you found to be Effective?
I worry that by using hormones, not only would I potentially increase my chances of cancer, but also that I am just prolonging the menopause and would still have to go through it when I came off the hrt anyway,but I could really do with some sort of help through this as it's not much of a life at times
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hello lisajp, you sound very unhappy but can I say how I find sharing feelings on this forum really helps as the ladies are so lovely, reassuring and helpful. It makes you not feel alone.
I chose not to take HRT and that was right for me. Other ladies choose to take it and there are others who really know about it so I am sure they will discuss your fears with you. If you can manage without it and want to manage without it you can. From what I have read it isn't always a cure all and sometimes causes problems of its own but I don't want to cause ill feeling because the 'HRT or not' debate I have seen can get heated at times.
Anyway the way I have managed it for the last 5/6 years is to address each symptom individually. For my hot flushes and sweats I use a fan and a Magicool spray, also a gel pack that is kept in the freezer I put that on my neck. I have successfully used St John's Wort to stabilise my mood for some years and it works for me. I use glucosamine to support my joints and a multivitamin every other day. I also listen to my body and if I can't cope with something I don't do it to try and avoid stress.
I guess I am fortunate in that I no longer work because if I had to go to work every day and concentrate and focus like a lot of the ladies here still do then I may well have tried HRT before now.
I am not afraid of it and I sincerely think you do not need to be terrified of it either but I think you need a lot more information and reassurance about it and I will leave that up to the ladies who know about it.
All the best, Jane :)
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Hi and welcome to MM Lisjp.
The menopause is tough for many women and you are not alone.
Have you or your family had some experience of cancer which gives you this terrible fear?
Do read up all the info under the headings to the left of this screen - there is even a section on alternative techniques.
I personally have not had any luck with all the various herbal remedies etc - I've spent a fortune over the years. I do take Menopace to support my general health as it is known that our immune systems are more compromised once we are menopausal. I also take Omega 3 to help with joint aches etc.
The debate about HRT and whether to use it will go on and on. I am personally not happy to use HRT but see it as a necessary compromise.
I had a premature menopause so had to use HRT for many years. I took myself off HRT at 49 as I felt I shouldn't need it any more and really struggled with meno symptoms for 3 years hoping things would subside and get better. At 53 I had so much stress in my life I needed to be on top of my game and went back on HRT. I am now 58 & I have been without HRT for nearly a year - although I cope with the flushes etc during the day, the nights are really tough and I now have vaginal atrophy and bladder problems all associated with oestrogen deficiency. I am considering going back on HRT.
Sadly there have been so many negative stories about the risks involved with HRT but most of these have been over blown - the press do love these things. HRT doesn't suit all women but if you find the right preparation that works for you it can transform your life.
Like you, I thought using HRT was just delaying the inevitable but we tend to have a mantra on MM - "quality of life is very important". If the meno symptoms are seriously impeding your ability to get on with life then if HRT gives you some quality of life that is great. You also mustn't forget the other benefits of HRT - it protects you heart and bones and helps to prevent vaginal atrophy and bladder problems!!!
The research on HRT actually shows that women who have a hysterectomy and don't use oestrogen are at a higher risk of getting breast cancer. It is the combined HRT (Oestrogen with progesterone) that can bring a very small increased risk of breast cancer if you use HRT beyond the age of 60 - (you need progesterone if you have a uterus to keep the lining from thickening). However newer HRT regimes which include natural hormones are considered safer. I have to say, if you have been using progesterone cream then in theory you have been using a form of Hormone replacement therapy.
There are many ladies on this site who use many alternative methods to help them cope so hopefully they will be along with advice soon.
Keep posting DG x
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Thank you for your replies, why is it so tough being female?
My mum died of non Hodgkin's lymphoma on Christmas eve 7 years ago, and although not related in anyway to hormones ( as far as I'm aware) it was just very very traumatic.
I also teach dancing and one lady at my class had breast cancer caused by oestrogen in HRT, and another is currently being treated for breast cancer with secondaries, found by a routine mammogram.
As you say I am in effect already using a form of HRT in serenity cream, and not really happy about that, or convinced it is helping anymore.
My worse symptoms are the night sweats, and brain fog/ mood swings,many General feeling of doom and gloom, but also bladder issues, urge incontinence, and dryness of hair, skin, and nails.
Just feel detached from myself, like I'm lost inside myself! But what to do is the question?
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Hi Lisajp
Sorry to hear you are suffering and your story is similar to many and I can understand your fears. My father died of cancer too.
Like you I used what I thought were alternative remedies when I was peri-menopausal ( Black Cohosh, phyotoestrogen rich diet etc) and thought it was helping but in reality it was just that my body was not far enough into peri-menopause and my oestrogen levels had not dropped far enough to make my symptoms severe.
When my periods were getting quite scarce (I was 53 1/2 when I had last natural period) just before I was 54 I just couldn't cope with the sweats and flushes(I was working almost full-time) and decided to take HRT. Like you I was worried about it as I hadn't read anything about it and had just heard the bad press.
When I googled some info I came up with this website (it must have been in its early days as it was 2007) which gave lots of information about the different types so I decided to start right from the beginning with a "nil-by-mouth" approach to hormone replacement and to use hormones that are biologically identical to those in our own body These are all available on NHS as Dancinggirl has already told you. I have been doing this since then and I am now 61.
Re the risks and benefits of HRT - there is a lot of information on this site and I would urge you to read as much as you can about it. If you look at the menu on the left - 3rd green tab down (Hormone Replacement Therapy) has lots of sub-tabs about risks and benefits. In particular you will see that aged under 60 the benefits exceed the risks. http://www.menopausematters.co.uk/balance.php
There is also info about breast cancer risk: http://www.menopausematters.co.uk/risks.php Sorry to hear about your friend but it really is not possible to say that her breast cancer was caused by HRT. However many existing breast cancers are stimulated by oestrogen so added oestrogen can cause them to grow (this is how I understand it anyway).
It is also thought that bio-identical HRT is less associated with risks overall than tablet HRT with synthetic progestogens and equine oestrogens.
You can minimise your overall cancer risk by so many other lifestyle factors - by not smoking, limiting alcohol intake to within recommended limits, taking more exercise, reducing weight to healthy limits and eating healthy diet with plenty of fresh fruit and vegetables and limiting processed foods.http://www.menopausematters.co.uk/diet.php
There was an article last week in the Daily Mail online in which Dr Currie founder of this site wrote in support of HRT. http://www.dailymail.co.uk/health/article-2800760/should-women-hrt-menopause-experts-say-s-best-way-ease-symptoms-avoid-long-term-health-problems.html
HRT will definitely improve bladder issues as well as many of the other symptoms. It is important to realise it is not a panacea but many women decide that despite some side effects or drawbacks they (I should say we because I am one!) feel better overall than without it.
As for putting off menopause - you don't really put it off as such. If/when you decide to come off - you may get hot flushes returning - but on the other hand you may not - but you won't get mood swings because your hormones will be stable so you ride through the rest of the peri-menopause.
I can say absolutely that my quality of life as I enter my 60's is positive! I am still working part-time, going away much more than I used to ( children more or less left now) and renewing old pleasures like going to festivals and live bands.
I don't see it as playing with hormones - just replacing oestrogen which is deficient - and can lead to other long term health problems. Of course it is a personal decision but needs to be made with all the most up-to-date information available - and this is where this site and the forum is great.
I hope I have helped a little with this :)
Hurdity x
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Oh Lisajp
I was just about to send you another post but Hurdity (very wise lady with a science background) has said everything and more that I wanted to say. Thank you Hurdity.
I used to be a professional dancer and a few years ago I started up an adult beginners ballet class. I had gone back on HRT so my energy had returned - it was such fun. I've moved house now so no longer do this class - might try doing it again if I go back on HRT.
Keep posting. Dg x
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Thank you hurdity and dancing girl, I so appreciate your help😊
IT is so difficult as I feel very overwhelmed by the cancer issues, like I would get cancer from taking HRT and wish I had persevered without it.
I have read the statistics and feel the benefits may well out do the risks at my age now, but I am concerned as to when I would stop it should I start it, and what effects that might have later on.
Another concern is another dance lady I know had blood clots after starting hrt and was poorly for quite sometime.
It feels that when i speak to other women, they look at you with the same look people get when they say they smoke or drink, if you mention HRT, like you are doing something bad to yourself.
There has been a lot of scare mongering and bad press re HRT I feel, to the point that lots of women, myself included, feel really terrified to try it, even if it could alter our lives.
I wasn't aware you could get 'nil by mouth' bio identical hormones on the NHS. I Must say that the idea of equine urine based hormones does repulse me somewhat.
Question, does HRT help with hair, skin and nails too?
Dancing girl, I am very fit, I teach 5- hours of line dance classes every Monday, fitsteps classes on Tuesday morning and Thursday evening, and Zumba on Tuesday and Wednesday evenings! No wonder my joints ache! 😊
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It can be a minefield but surely quality of Life is better than being worried about perhaps getting cancer from HRT? After all, 1 might fall in front of a bus 2-morrow ::) ……….. 1 symptom is OK but these tend to creep up until some ladies realise they have too many to deal with.
If 'natural' remedies worked they would be available on the NHS. However, some ladies do find that St John's Wort helps. Evening primrose, but eventually if our own hormones take over or drop off, symptoms become uncomfortable to deal with.
Vaginal atrophy can be sorted with topical HRT - my VA presented as repeated urine 'infections' which weren't followed by razor blades 'up there' >:( - now I have treatment to use twice a week my vagina is comfortable again.
I had cancer. 4 years prior to diagnosis I had 3 months HRT. Connected: maybe …… worried: nope. Quality is important. Read up, make a list of symptoms, perhaps keep a mood/food diary ……. and let us know how you get on!
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Wow Lisajp - I'm so impressed - and you do all this with your meno symptoms raging.
Well we certainly don't need to advice you to take more exercise. I'm afraid I just do brisk walks with my dog these days. My joints are suffering a bit after abusing them through my dancing days.
Blood clots are rare especially at your age.
The nil-by-mouth HRT Hurdity is talking about would be one of the patches (see under HRT Preparations) or she and many others are now using Oestrogen patches or gel with Utrogestan as the progesterone part and this is bio identical ( so is the same as our own hormones) and is described by Dr. Currie as 'Breast Friendly'. Utrogestan is supposed to used orally but many use it vaginally as it gives fewer side effects.
HAve you read the article on the Daily Mail website - Hurdity gave you the link i think?
Many GPs are not up to speed on meno treatment so many of us have to go to our GPs with info printed off from this site to show them what we want. Dg x
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… all that you wonder why ………… your body is trying to keep up at a time many of us are slowing down ::)
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Hi
Sorry to hear you are struggling. So many women just suffer through their 40s and 50s, never realising that something properly biological is going on and can be sorted out.
I am 44. All last year I noticed my periods, though still regular were much ligher and my PS was lasting much longer. Last Autumn I started suffering from generalised anxiety, for no reason. I presented at my GPs several times over the Winter, saying how dreadfully low and horribly anxious I was feeling. Despite my GP being in her 50s herself, the potential of being peri menopausal was never once mentioned.
She insisted I just needed anti depressants and started me on Sertraline, which was just pure poison and genuinely made me feel I was losing my mind. I suddenly became scared of the dark, like a little child and I totally lost any feelings of love or affection towards my husband and children. Plus, I had horrendous panic attacks on it (I have always been a very cool, calm and collected person - doing a professionally demanding job) which were just terrible.
I begged to be taken off it, and my GP switched me to amitriptyline because of it's known sedative effects. It worked. My anxiety disappeared but I then spent the next 7 months like a woozy zombie. I slept a lot and gained 11lbs in weight. But, all the while my periods were still getting lighter. And, I found this site and I started to wonder if it was just my hormones causing my issues - as very early menopause runs in the family.
But my GP dismissed my concerns, saying I was far too young. In desperation I switched to another GP, a much older man who AMAZINGLY took my worries very seriously, asked all the right questions and referred me to a specialist clinic. At the clinic the gynaecologist immediately diagnosed me as peri menopausal thanks to my symptoms and family history.
Since then I have had to wait 3 months for my follow up appointment at the clinic, and in that time my periods are even lighter. But, I stopped taking the amitriptyline 6 weeks ago and haven't missed it. No anxiety. Have lost the 11lbs I gained. Mood and sleep is back to normal. I feel fine again.
Not sure what to say to my gynaecologist at my next appointment, to be honest.
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Thanks for all the replies and advice, it does seem like one heck of a long journey the whole perimenopase to post menopause, and the symptoms that go with it.
I feel in this day and age that there should be lots more help, advice and support offered to us, it still feel a bit hush hush,something women should hide and put up with.
Trying to make an informed decision is almost impossible, at a time in your life when even thinking straight on a daily basis is a struggle.
All the women I see at my classes, and try to talk to, seem to poo poo HRT saying that menopause is a natural process and best just weathered. Yet I know from reading on this site that there are lots of advocates of HRT, why is it that everyone I meet looks at my like I'm an addict if I mention it?
It doesn't make the decision easy, and I feel like I'm a failure if I sucumb to HRT, so so difficult.
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Lisa
I know how you feel. But MM will help you so much ;)
You are not a failure to take or even succumb to HRT :o
Far from it, your taking control of your life and making your own choice.
We think of nothing taking other vitamins, minerals and supplements to try and keep ourselves healthy.
Vitamin D is not even a vitamin (its closer to being a hormone) but we still pop them to keep our bones healthy.
Why can't people just see it in the same way but understand its just adding to or replacing what we are missing.
HRT is more controlled and tested than a lot of the other things we would gladly take for our health :)
"All the women I see at my classes, and try to talk to, seem to poo poo HRT"
What were their words of wisdom and how old were they all?
I'm sure they were rolling out the similar misinformation I got from my doc even.
The decision is easy and simple.
Ask yourself "Is my quality of health and life getting worse?"
If the answer is yes then you need to take control and fix the problem.
Go to your doctor and ask for example femoston 1/10 or elleste duet 1mg to start you off with.
If you do choose to use HRT, then no one needs to know, its your business only.
If you want to share, then no doubt you'll get a lot more poo poo'ing going on.
Remember your not a failure.
Hope that helps
:-*
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Once again thank you all for your advice and support x
I am now using estriol cream every night for my bladder and soreness, and I feel it has helped, although this second week there have been days when my urgency problem has been an issue. Went back to GP today and she suggested using it nightly for another week, then drop it down to twice weekly, has anyone else done this? I'm concerned re the risk of the oestrogen going too much into my blood stream?
My GP has also put the prescription on repeat for whenever I need it. How often should I go yo see her for a review if I find the estriol does its job and looks like a long term relief for my problem?
Thanks ladies xx
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Hello Lisa
I think the instructions will tell you to use the estriol cream daily for a fortnight and then drop to twice weekly. By doing that you plump up the vaginal tissue and the result is that you don't get oestrogen travelling round the rest of your body (and do you realise that the cream you're using has minuscule amounts of hormone in it? I think I remember somebody posting that Vagifem which is comparatively much stronger has the equivalent over the year of two HRT pills in it)
So keep on using it - and please don't panic. For some reason lots of women have themselves in a real lather about HRT and think it's the devil, or giving in to something. It's not, and it's not. You can be "safe" and in pain - or use an exceptionally low-risk drug (your cream really is exceptionally low risk) and have quality of life. And as someone said upthread, you could go under a bus tomorrow.
Please, please don't worry about it. And maybe don't listen to those who do.
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Hi Lisa,
don't worry about the cream , if there was a likely hood of it giving you cancer your GP would not have prescribed it. It is quality of life. My mother had breast cancer and was on HRT for years. it hasn't put me off. I think it is more dangerous statistically to smoke or drink heavily than take HRT. In fact if I get the right dosage etc , I hope it increases my life span. And yes you start off using it nightly for a couple of weeks or more and reduce it to twice a week for 3 to 6 months and then they review the situation. Try some meditation it really does help. The anxiety and panic is so debilitating and it's impossible seeing the wood from the trees sometimes. Keep strong, things will improve,
Pepperminty xx
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lisajp
Ancient runner is absolutely right in all she says. I am 59 and am now on a very low dose of systemic HRT with Vagifem alongside to help with vaginal atrophy and bladder problems. Quality of life is very, very important. HRT is simply helping to reduce the negative effects of oestrogen deficiency and though there is still a strong anti HRT lobby there is also a more enlightened view point coming through that is showing that HRT has a good place in enabling many women to continue to work and be a productive part in society.
WE all need to listen to our bodies more and not let the judgements and opinions of others effect our decisions about doing the right thing for our own health and wellbeing.
It is now accepted that for many women local oestrogen treatment is necessary, probably for long term use, to prevent further deterioration of VA and bladder problems. Good luck DG x
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Thank you ladies xx I am beginning to feel more relaxed about using medications if necessary now, it's very true re the getting run over tomorrow possibility! And it's right that we should be able to help ourselves through this life stage in as safe aand informed way as possible.
From my understanding the original tests and results on HRT were based on the medication as it was then, which was predominant,y oestrogen from the ursine of pregnant mares. Whereas from what I understand now, most HRT is biodentucal in its make up, and therefore more recognised by the body?
At present I am continuing with the nightly application of estriol, and using serenity cream (progesterone) to oppose the oestrogen. I will see how I go with this for a few months I think xx
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Well done Lisajp,
I know how overwhelming it all can be initially, trying to work out what the best thing to do for you is- everyone's different. Just read as much as you can and be kind to yourself. Good luck .
Pepperminty xx
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Hi Lisa
Ancient Runner is absolutely right. Like you I have worried myself silly about the possible implications of taking HRT, based mainly on the negative feedback from others. Meanwhile, my quality of life from recurrent UTI's and discomfort had deteriorated so much that I felt constantly miserable. My Doctor was hopeless, not even suggesting anything to help , just giving me yet more antibiotics which did nothing to help, and the possible risks from long term anti biotics is far worse than a very low dose oestrogen cream.
I have taken the plunge after reading all the supportive help on here and am so glad I have. I am also using estrogen cream (Gynest) have just completed the two week course and can't believe how much better I feel. I have come to the conclusion that everything in life has risks and consequences, some we don't even think about. It's just a case of weighing up the risks and benefits.
Hope you persevere and you feel better very soon.
Hugs
W xx
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What a brilliant, informative thread, Thank you to all the ladies who have posted and shared their experiences and thoughts. I'm in the 'don't know which way to turn' category when it comes to HRT as like Lisa the risk of cancer has made me think that it's not for me. This has really helped me to get a better understanding and to put things into perspective. x
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Hi Lisa
I posted further up the thread quite a few months ago, before trying HRT myself.
Just wanted to let you know that I am now into my 5th week of HRT and I can't tell you how much better I feel already. I feel like all my inner lights have been switched back on. I am joking with my husband again and messing about with my children. My libido has returned much to my husband's delight ;) I feel optimistic and positive about my life. I feel like me again :)
I just wish that I had started taking HRT a year ago. Then I wouldn't have suffered needlessly so much. I essentially lost a whole year of my life to feeling anxious, depressed, morbid and hopeless. It wasn't a life, it was just a miserable, wretched existence. I just couldn't continue that way, I was so utterly miserable most of the time. I was living with a genuine mental illness caused by my bloody hormones.
If someone was suffering with a mental illness and were told that they could chose between suffering with it for the rest of their lives and feeling wretched, or taking a pill which would make it go away. Then I am sure that 99% would take the pill. Even if it meant there was a very small chance of cancer a couple of decades down the line.
But because menopause is supposedly 'natural' I think that subconsciously we think we should just endure it. I find this frankly bizarre as migraines are 'natural' but we don't just endure them. Thrush is 'natural' and we could simply not treat it and live in great discomfort and misery for years and years. But if you knew someone had had thrush for months/years and were wretched with discomfort but were refusing to get it treated, you'd think they were either insane or a masochist? Even if the thrush treatment came with a 2% higher risk of getting cancer years down the line.
It's everyone's personal choice whether to take HRT. But I can only assume that the women who chose not to, based on the tiny chance of getting cancer, simply can't actually feel THAT bad. I have felt so anxious and despairing at times that I would have taken anything to stop the misery. Anything at all. Even if it came with a higher cancer risk than HRT. Because I was reaching the point where I was starting to realise that actually being dead was preferable to feeling so horribly low and panic striken most of the time.
I am only 44, and as I understand it the risks of any type of cancer don't appear until after you turn 60 anyway? I also understand that I run a far higher risk of getting cancer from being over weight and drinking alcohol every day, rather than from taking HRT?
Well, I rarely drink and I am not remotely overweight. I think I'm pretty safe
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I was planning to post today. I am in the same boat, absolutely terrified of cancer. All day in fact I think about it, having just been through a cancer scare. My mum died of cancer too yet she was a good weight, no hrt, no smoking, no drinking etc etc. Who knows.
I feel if it would help my mood it would be worth it, but my gp is terrified as I have a blood disorder and he has said I must get permission from my consultant as I have many health issues too.
I really want to do without, mood is my big big big issue right now, the rest I can cope with. I'm getting all the hormone blood tests done, I know they don't mean a lot but I'm curious.
if I could just be happy and not be so frightened i would be OK. I am on a low dose SSRI and I'm sure its not helping but I'm too scared to put it up. In fact Im scared of everything right now, dare not even go on holiday which makes me so cross.
sorry rant over.
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Sarai, just a thought, but you might not BE so terrified and anxious if your hormone levels were better. There are a lot of ladies on here taking HRT because of such crippling anxieties.
Why not talk to your consultant - and check the info above on contraindications for HRT with different conditions. Yours might be there. You could even I believe have an email consultation with the specialist who runs this site - she might well be more clued up than your GP and your consultant.
Trouble is with that kind of anxiety (been there) is that you keep on thinking yourself in circles and never get anywhere. If you were able to take a step to find out more about your blood disorder and how that works with HRT that would be a first step. Good luck!
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I had breast disease in the 1990s. Still here >wave<: Sarai - how old was your Mum? My Gran died of cancer but she was 82 ::)
I have to use the Estriol as and when - initially every night for 2 weeks then every 3/4 evenings. Without it Life wouldn't be worth living, it was like having razor blades 'up there' ::)
Glad to see this thread re-activated, nice to know how ladies get on with their decisions ;)
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I wish there were ' like' buttons for all these great posts! I feel that due to the results of tests done on HRT in the early 2000's and all the scary statistics at that time, that so many of us have and still are suffering with menopausal symptoms, even during our 40's and 50's when, by my own understanding, the benefits of HRT far outweigh the risks.
Think of all the women that have suffered years of diminished quality of life, and marriages that may have broken up due to the crazy mood swings, paranoia and depression that many of us suffer, not to mention lack of libido.
I think it's time Drs were better informed, and women might not feel so terrified or defeatist if they decide that HRT is worth a try for the quality of their life!
Website, Gynest is, I believe, the same strength as estriol, just a branded version, 0.01%, it is definitely improving my bladder and VA issues, but Dr suggested another week on nightly application, as after having 'relations' (ahem 😱) with hubby, my bladder/ urethra was back to being overactive for a few days this week, so hoping that after this week I can drop it down to twice a week.
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Trial and Error ::)
We have this :thank you: instead of a 'like' button ;)
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Ancient runner, you are so right. I am at present circling myself all day long. Mostly I just long for bedtime as it is my safe place. luckily, or not, my anxiety is confined to daylight hours. At least when I'm asleep, which is never a full night, I am out of it for a while.
I think My consultant is the one I trust as he is a professor and he did actually discover the condition I have, and it is named after him so he knows his stuff and me of course.
If I had not had my cancer scare, lasting 3 months culminating in surgery, I don't think I would be in this state but right now I literally am obsessed with cancer, I feel its waiting in the wings to bite me all day long. Awful it is.
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CLKD, my Mum was 66, her primary cancer was unknown, she died of secondary liver cancer. So I am filled with remembering any issues she had thinking which cancer it may have been. But I only need to see it written or hear it said for my heart to lurch right now. i have very bad health anxiety, if you hadnt guessed.
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Sarai, I really feel for you. I had a cancer scare too a few years ago and wound up in the same state as you. With the help of counselling (Macmillan), ADs (for a short period) and sleeping pills (even shorter) I got out of that constant obsessing and to a normal level of anxiety. I couldn't see how I would ever un-know having had cancer and possible future ramifications, but mostly I have. And I've found ways of keeping myself mentally OK - see my username for clues!
Please, please get some help and get out of this really damaging cycle.
The other thing is that most cancers aren't a contra-indication for HRT (again, see the menus above).
If nothing else you need some help to get out of your current mental state and enjoy your life again - breaking that anxiety cycle is the thing to do. Does your GP know the state you're in?
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Ancient Runner - thanks for your responses :)
Sarai - 66 is no age is it. Were you with your Mum during this time? Certainly talking to someone who deals with cancer/patients/nursing might ease your constant worrying. Could you contact Macmillan Nurses for advice, they may have a support system, or 'backup' charity?
I had years when I had no relief from my phobia, as I would have nightmares :'(
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Ancient runner, I did not have cancer as it turns out but had a series of invasive tests and surgery over a 3 month period just to discover I had the all clear. At that point my mind just collapsed. My gp knows I was put forward for CBT in February and am still waiting. I know I'm in a mess but have no way out that I can see.
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CKLD no 66 is too young. And I thought she was healthy too, she lived 7 weeks from diagnosis, I was with her every day and at the end. I'm an only child. I have fretted a lot since wondering what cancer she had but they weren't interested in finding out.
I have no idea about talking to somebody as CBT list is months long here and I guess so man things including hormones are attacking me. A counsellor won't be interested in hormones.
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Why on Earth do you say that ::) - regardless of what the causation of anxiety etc. is, a fully trained Psychologist or Counsellor will do their best to listen, make suggestions as to what to expect short/long term and may well give you home work ;D - mine did and she knew when I hadn't bothered ::)
I would ring your GP to find out where the sessions will take place then contact their Office to see how long you will have to wait and put yourself forwards for a cancellation too. In the meantime there are relaxation CDs etc.
Someone would have known which cancer caused your Mum to die …….. is *your* GP aware?
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At present I am continuing with the nightly application of estriol, and using serenity cream (progesterone) to oppose the oestrogen. I will see how I go with this for a few months I think xx
Hi Lisajp
Just to say you do not need to oppose vaginal oestrogen with progesterone! Very little oestrogen gets into the blood stream with vaginal oestrogen and has almost no effect on the endometrium - only in very rare cases.
In addition the estrogen in the cream you are using is called estriol, not estradiol and is 7 to 8 times weaker than estradiol in its effects on estrogen (alpha - I think) receptors - so it will have even less effect on the system.
Don't waste your money on the progesterone cream and I hope your symptoms improve :)
Hurdity x
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Thanks Hurdity, but I have been using serenity for some time, about three years, and I do think it helps with other things a bit, like brain fog and anxiety, although I have found since having had no periods at all from last August, that ALL my menopausal symptoms have worsened and been difficult to handle 😟
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Lisajp
Your symptoms will be worsening because your oestrogen levels are dropping more now. They should bottom out over the next year or two but hopefully symptoms may start to subside after that but if things get too much then full HRT is the answer. DG x
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Thank you dancing girl x
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I have been resisting posting for a couple of days because I was feeling a bit invisible. But I just want to say 'thank you' to all of you. I get so much relief from this site when I read the posts and understand that other women are going through exactly the same as me.
Thanks again Sally G
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Hi Lisa
do you drink alcohol?
The reason I ask is that for ladies using alcohol it is much more detrimental than using HRT.
Its just our doc's don't see the alcohol as the same "demon" as HRT.
They certainly don't warn us that alcohol is much worse for breast health whether we take HRT or not!
Hope that helps put things in context?
:-*
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Hi Lisajp,
I have read this thread with great interest.
I am terrified of cancer too and always swore I would not take HRT because menopause is a 'natural' (as someone has already mentioned) thing that is supposed to happen to your body. However, this was before my symptoms really kicked in. Now I feel so awful and there are so many things wrong with me that I am feeling like the pros outweigh the cons. I have two years before I can take early retirement and I just can't see how I can get through them like this.
It is difficult to make an informed decision since nobody talks about the menopause (nobody I know anyway!). But reading the posts here and reading up research online, I am now wondering if it is any more dangerous that taking the pill when younger - or drinking as peegeetip mentioned.
My mother never took HRT and sailed through whereas my mother in law did take HRT and had a horrible time. I guess it is an individual thing but if there is something out there that will make me feel human again and give me some quality years back I think I am going to give it a try.
Hope you continue to feel better.
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Hi Diva
do you like alcohol? If your having such a hard time in the run up to retiring then I'm sure like me you might like a glass of wine or two etc.
So why the fear on HRT in comparson ???
We often ignore those things that do us more harm to the detriment to other things like HRT that do more good.
Last year someone posted that their friend had tried to convince her about the ills and dangers of HRT whilst puffing away on a cigarettes?! Hypocritic, stupid, unhelpful or all three ?!
I'm sure the stress your mind and body are going thru without HRT are much worse for you in the long term also.
No one seems to want to consider the other side of our lives and how that might put us in more danger than HRT.
:-\
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Thank you all for the replies, it's true we must get it into context in our minds re the risks, of HRT, let's be honest, 'natural' or herbal remedies, may indeed carry just as many risks for all we know? Just because they are derived from plants, doesn't necessarily mean they are only doing good, or what they may do with long term use.
I'm having a bad hormonal day today, with my anxiety and paranoia and feeling rubbish at everything, just feel so sad, and flat, like where have I disappeared to? When will I ever feel normal again?… can HRT help with all the depression and anxiety?… is it a cure all? Or does it just open up a different lot of problems to deal with? Like migraines, weight gain? and periods?.. :(
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Hi Lisa
I know its helped me since starting and yes I do feel much better with myself.
"Like migraines, weight gain? and periods?"
Just to answer those points you make.
Headaches for years through peri and doc didnt have a clue. Now that I'm on HRT, I still get headaches now and again but thats just normal run of the mill. So its helped me a lot there.
Weight gain is just a myth. I think most of us are gaining before we reach for HRT. My weight rose without fail till I started HRT and now I've stabilized since starting, feel much better and don't feel I have to watch everything I'm eating now.
Periods. Well I don't have to guess anymore, which was a real pain when they were miles apart. Since HRT the periods are much easier to deal with for me. Initial 2-3 months was more painful and bit longer than usual but after that initial "body getting used to them again" part, things have been much much better.
I did try to get on the tridestra which gives 1 period every 3 months but doc told me a load of rubbish on that. Sometimes wonder if I should swap over but to be honest being back to normal seems to suit me so much more than the peri (near meno) me :) ???
:-* :-*
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Hi , I had symptoms before HRT and that's why I went on it. I am better on it than off it at the moment, not perfect , but I wasn't before. It does help ladies with menopausal / hormonal depression. Personally I think it's worth a go for quality of life .
Peppermintyxx
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"When will I ever feel normal again?… can HRT help with all the depression and anxiety?… is it a cure all?"
This part took me 6 months plus on HRT.
No point saying its a cure, as others would disagree. But I feel it came very close to that for me.
I did a lot that I'm not proud of prior to HRT starting.
Was it due to depression, anxiety, brain fog and time running out that caused me to be such a pain to DH and my family?
Not sure to be honest but I still feel terrible sometimes when I look at how I'd changed and how low I'd sunk.
All I know was that I had become a bit of a train wreck prior to starting HRT.
Around the time of starting HRT, my docs caused most of the immediate anxiety due to their approach to HRT.
I felt guilty and weepy for first month partly due to the docs making me feel like I was a "cheat" and a "failure" for going down the HRT route.
I was not a cheat or a failure, I was taking back control in the quality of my life again :)
I'm so glad I did choose HRT and I only wish I had done this so much earlier.
:-*
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Hi Lisajp
Sorry to hear you are having bad day. I agree with what peegeetip has said re depression and anxiety and the other things.
Yes HRT is not a magic cure ie there will be downsides but for most women and if you get the right preparation and the right dose it should make you feel better more days than not!
The peri-menopause is a difficult time becaise the hormones are fluctuating so much but the gradual overall decline in oestrogen levels can give rise to low mood and depression-like feelings in many women.
If you didn't feel especially depressed or anxious before you started the peri-menopause (except during second part of your cycle/pmt/period time) then it is surely hormonally induced and which hormone replacement can alleviate for the most part. A low dose body-identical HRT will prevent the extreme dips in oestrogen and should help you remain more on an even keel. I am still on HRT - a medium dose - although this is quite low and it certainly means I am able to maintain an even, positive mood most of the time (although lacking the excitement of my fertile years!).
Is there anything you can do in your life each day or generally to help deal with the feelings of flatness and anxiety? I know that others have posted about how they make themselves overcome these feelings through psychological techniques.
SallyG - sorry to hear you are feeling invisible - is that on here on in life generally? Do you know what has brought this on? At leaast on here as you say everyone is going through or has gone through the same thing and can support each other!
Hurdity x
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Thank you all for sharing your personal experiences, all of which help considerably.
How did you deal with the element of fear/anxiety when you first started taking it peegeetip?
At least I know it is available if I find things becoming more unbearable.
Are most HRT bio identical now?
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Hi Lisa
I'd say dont leave it till it becomes unbearable.
From what I've seen on the forum those who leave it late have the least/worst results.
I just wish I'd started earlier before some of the issues down below :-\ started to get worse.
Luckily I had not left it too late but given the low dose I was on it took me 6 months + for some of the more personal symptoms to heal/fix.
If I'd started earlier when the sweats/flushes started then I could have avoided the more personal problems!
One thing the docs never tell you ??? !!!
From what I've read now I wish I'd stayed on the pill longer as its a good step prior to going to HRT apparantly and free ;)
In terms of the anxiety and fear (of god) that the doc's put into me, luckily I had support on that front.
If I'd been on my own or people had run away screaming from the mad lady I'd become then I think things might have been really difficult.
Perseverance is the key, sticking with a plan, dealing with the initial whoosh as your body reawakens is not for all of us and some are more sensitive to this than others.
I do think some mixup side effects and the body just getting used to the hormones again.
Again the longer you wait to jump on board the worse thats likely to be.
Also more recent advice says the sooner we start the better protection we have for heart, circulation, bowel, skin and down below to name but a few ;)
Its your choice on whether you ever take HRT but remember there are worse things for us and we do them without thinking often. Dont get too wrapped up in the old out of date stuff the docs rattle on about. Just decide on what you want and go with it.
:-* :-*
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Peegeetip, what a great answer. :)
I do think some of the negative stuff round HRT is along similar lines to the snide stuff you see in the Daily Mail about women, often written by women. We can sometimes be our own worst enemies and for some reason there's an attitude that it's morally wrong to replace hormones we've had all our adult lives and should be martyrs. People do love to scare you - on zero information.
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Thanks again ladies, re 'down below' I am just coming to the end of my three weeks (on Drs advice) loading of Estriol nightly application, this is 0.01% estriol.
I do feel it has helped with my bladder and soreness issues, will see how I progress once on the twice a week regime.
Regarding hormonal crash days and anxiety and paranoia, and feeling withdrawn, this is what I am keeping a close eye on, it's horrible when it occurs, and if it occurs regularly, then I will consider systemic HRT, for my own and my lovely family's wellbeing xx
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depression can be eased with medication; anxiety too ………. so some ladies do find that taking medication, if it helps, is worth taking for 8-12 months - enables them to see the wood for the trees ;)
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Thanks CLKD, when you say medication, are you referring g to HRT. Or antidepressants?