Menopause Matters Forum
General Discussion => Birthdays and Events => Topic started by: CLKD on April 16, 2013, 01:04:30 PM
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:'(
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It's horrific. Violence is becoming so commonplace, it breaks my heart.
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Terrible scenes of devastation.
And all for what.
My brain just can't begin to understand the mind set of people who would do such a thing.
I don't really like the world we live in sometimes.
Honeyb
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Have just been watching this on TV. Horrific :(
I have got to the point where I really don't want to go anywhere that's too crowded any more.
I know that's letting these people win, but it terrifies me, it really does. >:(
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I remember my parents avoiding very busy places when I was a child. It was not until I was older that I was told that it was due to the IRA bombings of British cities.
They never bomb anywhere on the west of Scotland as they had too many supporters here but it was an ever present threat in people's minds.
I would not be surprised if there was trouble at the big funeral tomorrow.
Honeyb
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Hopefully the security will be secure enough for tomorrow. I wouldn't visit London because of the IRA. Milton Keynes worries me too, all that glass :-\ ......... these types of people will never realise that bombing etc. does no good to their cause >:( .........
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I just can't understand in this day and age, with all our experience of past conflict and terrible crimes committed against humanity, that anyone could still want to inflict violence against innocent people.
You would hope that such things would be something to look back on in horror and know that they could never happen again.
Why can't mankind be man....kind? :'(
ariadne xx
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Well said. :'(
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'Cos men can't - be kind. Generally they want what everyone else has >:( ....... or their 15 mins of fame. Usually it's men that take 'us' to War. Kids fight in the playground, if you watch young boys they will pick up a stick and use it like a gun or sword, without being shown >:(
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London marathon this weekend. Just hope our security is good enough. Pictures from Boston were so scary. I was trying to visualise where it was as we went there on holiday once. We were near Boston green.
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Was said today that London and Belfast have the most terrific surveillance, way ahead of ours in U S -- obviously.
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I think this morning's event went off without too much incidence ....... we certainly 'do' pagentry really well ;)
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Have you ever been to the UK Trey?
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I hate the fact we are watched all the time. It's intrusive and unnecessary most of the time.
Honeyb
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It has never bothered me ......... you cannot have it both ways! and if one has nothing to hide ;) ...........
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Yes, have been to the UK. Drove all over. Loved it. Born in Canada, but didn't live there really, left at three years old.
I wouldn't care if they had cameras on every block. Maybe then we cowboys could put our ##%*+ guns away.
I'm so fed up with these crazys.
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CCTV doesn't bother me in the slightest nowadays. Would rather have it than not. Though if it was introduced into suburbia I wouldn't like it.
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Isn't it in suburbia then? I thought it was used widely in most places. We have it in our village in the little shopping precinct. Crime is committed in all areas so it makes sense not to restrict it to cities.
Taz x
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My attitude is if someone is not doing anything wrong, who cares who sees and if someone is doing something wrong, I hope someone does see. Google can tell where I took a photo if I don't turn certain settings off so..............
I do turn all on privacy settings TBH so maybe I'm a bit of a hypocrit.
Wonder if affairs have gone down in London with all this surveillance?
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We have a CCTV camera on our house linked to a PC. I often see cameras in the towns/countryside and wonder how long they have been 'there' ::) 'cos I'm not that observant :-\ - unless it's someone driving using a mobile phone or drinking a coffee which he has just tipped into a cup from a vacuum flask >:(
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Not beside us CLKD. Most cameras are placed in the centre of town, where most of the trouble happens.
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We have one camera in the nearest town to us and none in our village. Nothing around the housing areas but it's very quiet here.
Do you watch your CCTV if there is nothing on the TV CLKD.
Honeyb
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;D ........... nope. Too busy doing other stuff. Would be handy to see if the hedgehogs go through the garden though ???
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WACO burns again :-\
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Oh my goodness what devastation.
Truly hope it was an accident and not terrorism.
What happens in America has a habit of drifting our way.
Honeyb
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One would have thought: fertiliser factory, there will be cylinders of all types of gas etc.? :-\ ........ hindsight I suppose <sigh>
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It was a tank of ammonia which exploded but I don't know what caused the original fire.
Taz x
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It was something like ammonia but in powder form, DH went :o that'll burn when he heard, as a chemist he recognised the implications immediately
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Why on earth did they let the volunteer fire fighters run into a building full of obvious explosive material. What on earth were they thinking?
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People do the weirdest things in the weridest of situations <sigh>
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Scary that two brothers, one only 19 years old, along with three more people who are in custody, could plan and succeed in bombing the Boston marathon. Again though, like most of these things, it has become apparent that the eldest one (shot dead early yesterday and had recently become a devout Muslim who prayed five times a day - what are these Muslim's teaching people?) came to attention two years ago - how can these people then go on to cause such devastation? More loss of life during their getaway attempt, they killed a policeman and severely wounded another officer. The mother of the eight year old boy that was killed has brain injuries and his sister lost a leg - how do a family come through all that? Scary, scary f***ed up world! Sorry, rant over!
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The world has been like this for a long, long time. The Crusades began in 1095 and nothing much has changed since!
Taz x :(
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I'm so confused. This morning a crowd was chanting, USA, USA and I don't get it. Why weren't they chanting, Violence, Background checks. The FBI was alerted in 2011 about the older terrorist. Talk about a lousy background check. The little girl, who loved to dance, now lost one leg and possibly part of the other............ :'(
This isn't a sports event
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Where there are men there will be violence.
We began the Crusades :sigh: ........ and I think that the Muslim World is now getting it's own back :-\
However: OUR MARATON TOMORROW - BBC 1 - hope the sun shines like it has today :-*
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Sun is great for the spectators but not so good for the runners.
Taz x
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True Muslims don't preach death or killing in the name of Allah, Fundamentalist take the teachings out of context and this is what they are instructing and teaching these terrorists, nothing to do with Muslims getting there own back, most ordinary Muslims will be horrified at the pure evil of these men.
There has been more people killed in the name of religion through the ages including Christians and to me it makes me doubt the point of it
all.
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There has been more people killed in the name of religion through the ages including Christians and to me it makes me doubt the point of it
all.
Religion, whatever it is, usually is not good
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Amen :'(
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There are extremists in every religion. There are also so many more good decent people in the world.
Only trouble is being quiet and decent does not bring notoriety which some crave.
No matter our thoughts on religion we should never judge by the actions of a few.
I was brought up in a deeply divided society. Protestants and Catholics.....some of it was terrible and things happened that I will never forget. My parents fortunately were not religious or bigoted so that helped.
Honeyb
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They are off !
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Who?
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Oh keep up! the Marathon runners in London ::) .......... sunshine, good atmosphere, lots of encouragement ......... from my armchair ;)
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Its the stealth the worry we have of being anti Muslim anti Migrants anti this that and the other
I had a weird but sad conversation with a lovely young muslim women here in ozz she was about late 20s
We were in a shopping mall my pal had gone to buy make up and i was sitting dow and this little boy 3ish runs up to me MUMS chasing him she wasnt over covered Long full blouse like covering in grey and full headscarf
she said sorry we got chatting she burst in to tears said she was so lonely Her hubbie was a Doctor
they been in Nrth of England for 5 years where there were loads of Muslims Then they moved Here to Ozz
Shed been here 2 years and couldnt understand why people didnt acept her she asked if it was the headress
I said love I dont know but it puts a barrier between people after wed chatted she got up and i just did what anyone would do hugged her She held tight kissed me on my cheeks and said Thank you and off she went
My first thought after shed gone was wonder what her hubbie would have said this middle aged women with a low top
Jeans spikey hair and 3 crosses visable on my kneck bet hed not have liked it then I thought maybe I was wrong
I dont care what the parsnts say about their sons cos they are their sons and they olove them
If only good decent Mulahs would stand say these things are wrong If only muslim people did the same but most dont
They keept their heads down and say nothing and whats that saying
All it takes for evil to prosper is for good men to do nothing
Perhaps now its time no matter how hard it sounds that migration and the mix Of some cultures and religions is halted
The Muslim people who migrate to the west it is not always happy for them Yes they are better of health financlially
BUT They find it hard to acept wests way of lifeMaybe helping them finacially and investing in their country of origin
May be better for them be with their family have jobs live their culture religion in their land with no anger 2 the weat
In this 2nd age of terror in my adult life maybe it doesnt work mixing and rearanging a Western Countries make up
Some migrants arent happy they dont accept the wests way even though they live there thats the passed on to kids
They want to live the Muslim way and have the rules of the Muslim ways but in a Christian or secular country
It really just makes me sad that anyone is hurt even the 2 young mens parents
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Sorry - totally forgot - not something I really take an interest in but I am in full admiration of those who take part in it!
Taz x
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It's an age thing ;D
SuziQ - that was a powerful piece! I know of areas in the UK the parents won't intergrate. The children are allowed to go to School then home and only mix with their own heritage. I suppose it's a bit like ex-pats who go to mainland Europe - never learn the language, don't mix with the 'locals' much :-\ but because we dress in similar fashion, ex-pats don't stand out in the same way.
Here in the Midlands I would love to go up to some of these young girls with their beautiful headscarves etc. and talk about their dress code. But a nearly 60 year old woman ........... :-\ ...........
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That was a powerful piece Suzi and I seem to have caused a new debate about muslims. I shouldn't have said that, but everytime we hear of terrorism, it seems to be these 'new' muslims that pray 5 times a day. I know the 'real' muslims will find it just as horrendous as we do and I agree about the hurt the young mens parents will be going through. Just seems such a sad world at times. :(
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Suzi - Wow, well done.
What you wrote was so moving.
You will have helped her lots, just speaking to her as a woman, not just a headscarf.
The sad thing is that the head scarves, do create a barrier, even when it's not intended as such.
Are you likely to run into her again?
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It's not the headscarves that worry me but the whole face covering thing.
I know it's their tradition but it's not ours.
Why when we visit their country we observe and respect them but they come to our country and end up with more rights than we have.
Councils that won't allow Christmas trees or cards for fear of causing offence. I really could go on and on.
We are or were a predominantly Christian country.
All are welcome but please respect us and our customs and we respect theirs.
Honeyb
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Well said Honeybun.
I do not consider myself discriminatory and my job requires me to be completely impartial.
I was even involved in a non-political friendship society to promote cultural exchange and understanding between a more enlightened Arab state and Scotland. I found that fascinating and met some very interesting and lovely people.
However, who knows what deep-seated fears and bigotries we may have.
I liked that my daughter's school celebrated / acknowledged the main religious events in a number of religions. They were not restricted from celebrating our own religious dates. All children were in involved in all events.
I do believe the political correctness seems to have gone overboard. If we go to live in another country, we are expected to abide by their rules and laws and practices.
The requirement to have sufficient population and skills is complex, so there will always be a need for immigrants, as we will also have people who emigrate to other climes. By all means, come to our country to work, contribute to society and the economy and live a new life with us. At the same time, as Honeybun says, live by our rules and laws and respect OUR rights to our culture.
Fx
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Sadly Fire thats NOT how it works
Most dont want to intergrate they want to be with their own people their own culture religion what ever that religion is
Im a migrant I too gravitated to UK people when I came to Ozz thing is though our heritage and customs are the same
Knowone asked the people if we wanted this mix All political parties went gung ho it didnt matter who you voted for
Thier stanse was the same Migratiom Migration some worked really well but sadly loads didnt
It left disenfrachised youth male and female in the 70s/80s angry hurt but they too didnt play a part
They wanted to be the same YET different I listen to some Indig London youth and they have this patou accent now
A cross between Carribean and Londoner/Cockney it sounds odd but thats the way its gone
gOup NoRth and in some areas of Bradford etc and not see any ladies who arent covered from head to toe children too
I dont blame them wanting to leave Pakistan and sub Sahran Africa with poverty civil wars
Problem so many dont want too fit into UK society They want to live their lives as if they were still in Pakistan etc
I firmly believe they see our Western attitude to live and let live as a weakness in us as a people a Race and a Nation
Its now unto the 2/3rd generation and these are the oyung men and women who want to belong but not to UK or OZZ
They want to be back in Pakistan Back in where ever it was they originated from and instead of being grateful to UKozz
They want more and more they want Sahri law They want so much and kowmatter what is siad we are Infidels
Its their duty to convert us I dont think for one moment many think like that but theres enough that do to cause harm
What do you do Ban all MOsques? Ban all Temples? Its way too late for that now BUT whats not too late is to stop
Stop family reunions stop migration for a while no more building of relig schools etc
Some how we have to get back to we are happy your here But if your not then please dont cause pain and death Please just go back and find the happiness and peace that in the west eludes you x
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I think that many issues are handed down through the generations, I know it's true within my family history ........ what was 'true' becomes muddled the more it is told. Also, other countries appear to be much more knowledgeable about the various policies World Wide - many of those countries have been invaded over and again and not only by the British. So they have to find their sense of identity in a very busy World. Then they blame where they are living on their problems without going back to their origins to find out how the situation is there now .......
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One of my best pals married to a Jamacan man wonderful chap speak betterer English than me
He and my pal have been married for 40 years have 3 Married children and 5 grandchildren
One of them was partic naughty going on about Jamaca Trnidad insulting his MUM who was white
Saying all sorts of things about diluting blood lines well Grt nan and Grt Gag who were in their late 70s had returned
Said grandson was shipped off to Trinidad one way ticket so he had to work and boy did he
He found out he didnt belong not cos he wasnt black enough but because he was considered too black
It seems the ideal is to marry lighter and they expected him (his paternal family) to be whiter and more educated
He wasnt a happy chappy He didnt like the food the TV no PUBS as much as he moaned about his MUM
Told his Dad he didnt fancy a "sister" he only liked white girls we think we are prej but to see it from other angle!!!
Hes a great young man NOW hes gone to UNI a bit later than the norm in Southampton
Hes engaged to a Yorkshire girl daughter of a farmer and all those mixed up years are over He now knows hes English
Maybe thats a way let who ever wants to go back go back on a non return basis for say 5 years see how they cope?
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Got to catch 'em first ::) ........ I think it's usual for 'teens' to blame their parents for everything and anything :-\ but add in the colour/ethic differences too >:(
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Got to catch 'em first ::) ........
....... made me laugh at the end of a tiresome day at work.
X
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How many of us kicked against the traces as we were growing up? Only now there isn't the discipline people can 'get away' with a lot more!
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Been thinking more about the headscarf / total face covering thing.
I think the reason they cover themselves so, is because they feel males, can't control their animal lust when confronted with unfettered hair.
I don't know whether this is actually the case.
But it seems to be a bit over the top to assume all men will behave in this manner,
Perhaps a bit rude to males everywhere, who are just getting on with their lives.
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I think it's more a control issue.
Women are lesser beings in that culture and they like to keep them down.
Honeyb
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Think you are right Honeybun.
But it still seems wrong that they assume that all men in this country can't control themselves.
OK I know some men are like that but not all. They are mostly civilised here?
The face covering thing is like an insult to all men here
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Muslim women dress modestly and wear the hijab in public and in the presence of men who are not close relatives. It is usually a personal choice they are not forced to wear it, but a lot of Muslim women quite like it and they do not wear the hijab indoors, they love beautiful clothes and make up and they are not downtrodden at least not the more well of.
Its in the third world where there is less education and more poverty that Muslim women suffer.
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Are you watching the Horizon programme tonight.
My understanding is that the general treatment of women in these cultures is very different to what we would find acceptable.
I am not sure they don't like men looking at them but their men don't like it.
They are much more controlled than we are or have ever been.
Sad but true......they accept abuse as their lot.
This of course does not apply to all.......but more than we would think.
Honeyb
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I agree honeybun, think it's more because their men want them covered - wonder if they are also not encouraged to learn English to keep them apart?
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Watching it now.
Horrifying
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My OH has spent many years in Saudi Arabia - he has always been very upset at the way women are treated there.
Taz x
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Women are their fathers possessions and then their husbands.
I feel so sorry that in the 21st century women are treated like this and for some they just accept.
Honeyb
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There are just as many controlling cruel men as there are kind gentle men in any race, colour or creed.
I have lived in Muslim countries when I was younger, my best friend lived next door and she had a Muslim father and a Chinese mother, I never saw any controlling behaviour, they were a happy family and I use to go on holiday with them to Penang, this was in the early sixties.
Some women are treated very badly ( in some countries dreadfully but they are beginning to fight back) I know and I have worked with Muslim women who have been, but there are some women who find the Muslim faith makes them feel protected and secure, its all a matter of outlook and circumstances.
British women can have a tough time with some men and can be treated very badly and find it very hard to leave an abusive relationship, the behaviour of the men can often be learned down through the generations.
Women in general have had a tough time through the ages, its only since we got the "vote" that women's lives have changed in the Western World and we can see how other cultures differ from our own attitudes, which up to then was always a "Man's World" and women's fortunes were always dependant on men.
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This is why that 14 year old girl was shot and rushed to the UK to be treated - because she wants free schooling for girls. Also female circumcision is common World wide, including the UK :'(
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Thanks CLKD my brother before he died worked in Saudia teaching and no women
He could have taken his wife and daughter but refused after 2months there he wouldnt subject them to intolerance
Women couldnt drive even princess are stoned to death if they do anythng wrong
A womens raped unless she has 4 MEN to say its true they saw it shes killed
MUlim women in India are reg burnt to death by parent in in law and husbands to keep her dowry
You hear and see on TV etc Modernised weatern Muslim women whod not last 1 day in Pakistan
They go on about hoe enlightened the religion is yet even here in Ozz these women had to get permission
To go to the shops with out a man In India girl babies are murderd reg by all religions cos sons are wanted
But its taken us western women 1,920 years roughly to get the Vote 1,960 years before e got custody of uor children
Look now as my pal whos gay said hes my age
In 1980 in Ozz homosexuality was ilegal Jail now 32 years later
They can marry they can adopt children they have the same rights as any other member of society
Thats how it should be BUT even he said he thought most of it was cos they were men its always been that way
IT only took the HOmosexual community 32 years to gain all their rights meanwhile us women
2000 years later we are still awaiting equality and thats us Western women so the other god only kows how long
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Many years ago my Uncle was offered a position in Saudi but his wife would not have been allowed to drive or be seen in the street unaccompanied so they went to Kuwait instead.
It's a rum old World :-\
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Yes there are many controlling men in our society. The difference is they are the exception and not the norm. Of course there will be a small number of Muslim women who will fight the trend.
There are however so many women who are brought up to accept this as their lot.
Why should that be......ok I will answer my own question......fear.
They are scared. Under educated....they are left with few choices.
Sad.....but true.
Honeyb
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Even those with an education recognise their cultural restrictions.