Menopause Matters Forum
Menopause Discussion => Other Health Discussion => Topic started by: Justjules on January 27, 2016, 01:24:48 PM
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sorry ladies, I'm posting here because if I post on the No More Panic site I will get myself in more of a state....
After I'd eaten last night, only a couple of fish cakes as appetite still not good.....got pains under right rib and right through back on left side - made a mint tea thinking it was a bit of indigestion/trapped wind but couldn't lie on that side so watched tv laid on right on sofa....went to bed but still woke up with discomfort this morning. It feels like a pulled muscle type pain now but is still in ribs on left and pains mainly on left but across back....stupid, stupid me, googled because I was worried about pancreas and of course, it's pancreatic cancer......it says people tend to report feeling like pulled muscle pain...just when I was starting to see a light at the end of the tunnel....I'm terrified now....I did have an small bowel MRI last year....would that have shown anything like that up then and does this type of cancer come on quickly? I am so scared ..... my HA is now playing out the worst scenario....
Sorry for posting on here but at work fretting....x
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>sigh< - stop GOOGLING? he doesn't have any Degrees tha knows nor can he be objective!
Probably indigestion, pulled muscle, trapped nerve. Think back to what you have done in the last 7-10 days? hoovering, bending more, sitting badly?
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Can't think of anything and with it coming on after eating.....also, wouldn't be as worried if it wasn't in ribs as well as back...I'm being silly I know, it's just this bloomin health anxiety thing going into overdrive....
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If you have pancreatic cancer, then so do I. I often get twinges in ribs, back, upper back, lower back and so on. Your body is running on adrenalin which primes the muscles to fight or flight or freeze- the downside of this is that if you don't actually do any of the running away etc, that you end up tense with too much of the wrong sort of chemicals sloshing round inside you. Lactic acid builds up in tense muscles so you can feel as if you've run a marathon when all you've done is hold yourself in a constant state of tension. The best thing you can do is move a bit more, do some relaxation, have a massage or warm bath with Epsom salts. The worst thing is checking your body for aches and pains and reading Dr Google.
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Coldethyl, this is like a proper spasm/muscle pain and discomfort in front left rib cage and back which was really bad for a while - could hardly move and tried to lie down to disperse it but it made it worse - not just an achey type thing and it came on so quickly out of nowhere.
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Get them in bed at night quite often. Both sides. Sometimes it is trapped wind that sets it off other times I've no idea, but it really hurts and I can't lie down on wherever it is. Today my lower legs are in spasm. Our bodies aren't designed to be this anxious for this long. I think you need to go back to GP and book double appointment and try and work out a plan of action re therapy for you. I don't know what your area is like, but you can access higher level CBT from a psychologist if you find that the lower level stuff wasn't enough. Mind also offer CBT and other therapies so it might be worth speaking to them too. I think that at the minute you are just going round in circles with worry and without addressing the underlying issues, next week it'll be MS or a brain tumour. I know how you feel as I've been there and as soon as you get a handle on one worry, your symptoms shift and you start off with a whole new one. None of us can know 100% that we are well nor can we feel well all of the time but it is that certainty that you seek that is making you ill. As flippant as it sounds, what is the worst thing that could happen? OK - You could die. But that is a fact about being human. It is such a shame to waste what little time we have been given worrying about what will carry us off. There are no guarantees but you managed to live as if there were before and you can do that again if you get the right support. Xx
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speaking from experience, if you eat when anxious you eat too quickly (I do) and you do not chew properly (I don't) so you swallow air with your food and don't digest properly. then you belch and get acid reflux and heartburn and indigestion (I do). Then as the food passes through you get a churning tummy (I do) and, finally, flatulence and maybe colic (I do). Just speaking from experience and trying to put an objective spin on your worries, which are real and distressing but will not kill you xx.
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I just don't need anything else to start stressing about whilst I am trying so hard to take my medication and cope with that and still work. I know we need to die of something but it's the thought of the suffering that panics me and putting family through it but I'm trying not to go there....the only thing I keep holding on to is the fact that I did have the MRI last year and I've just had full bloods done and think it might have shown a problem there but haven't heard anything back urgently. I have Drs app next week to discuss meds.
Coldethyl, I am trying to work through stuff with the therapist I see but it's all relaxation and putting myself first and looking after myself etc. so I know all that, plus the distraction techniques. It's just years of Googling have given me far too much medical knowledge! Can't have anymore CBT at the moment as have had the NHS 'quota' and no more for 6 months. I was doing CBT techniques today trying to run through the different options it could be instead of the worst case scenario.
Sparkle - have no gallbladder - was taken out about 7 years ago.
Sorry again ladies, just helps to get it out....x
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Well I know I will have a lot of excess acid in my system even though I take Omeprazole every day as I've hardly eaten for two weeks properly because of the ADs supressing my appetite so that won't help. :o
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Hello Justjules.
I am so sorry that you are struggling. I actually googled Pancreatic cancer the other day and this, along with other problems show up on MRI scans and yours was clear.
I know HA is a horrible thing and sending hugs to you.
Take care and I hope you feel better soon.
K.
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Do you take betablockers as they can cause stomach issues too?
I think the problem is that your mind is looking for something to fixate on and your body is more than happy to oblige. Exposure therapy would suggest that you sat with the images of distress to yourself and your family should it be something serious but that is probably too far a step for you at the minute. I think you'd actually surprise yourself how well you'd cope in a real illness situation as I was fine with being diagnosed a diabetic yet my bunged sinuses have me thinking brain tumour!! It is hard and I think we all have far too much " medical" awareness these days which isn't helpful. It's like tinkering with a car engine because we've seen a picture of one online - only tests can show ( and not always then) whether we have x or y but we read lists of vague symptoms and think that's us.
You say you spent most of last week sitting agitated on the sofa.. That in itself is enough to set all manned of aches, pains etc off. The pain is real but the cause is so much more likely to be that than anything more sinister. Can you think of anything that has triggered this bout of health anxiety or have you always suffered? It may be worth paying to go privately for more therapy and as I said, Mind offer therapy for a donation. I'm not sure about a quota on NHS - they don't say your leg is broken still but you can't have anymore treatment. That's something I'd be getting angry about. Far better to try and focus outwards. You have my sympathy as it does suck big time but at some point you have to decide that enough is enough and step away from Google. It isn't your friend x
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Hi Jules,
I am new to this site and haven't experienced a fraction of what some of you have gone through so I'm going to leave the medical stuff to the seasoned members of this forum.
several years ago however I did train as a hypnotherapist with Paul Mckenna and as an NLP practitioner with the co creator of NLP Richard Bandler so I' going to stick to something that I know a little bit about and hope that it might help.
Whether the things that we worry about actually happen or not we all know that worrying about them dosent help and often makes things worse. However what few of us know is how to de-escalate that worrying once it gets hold of us. There are a number of different approaches that you could learn to help you deal with your health anxieties and understandable concerns and get things checked out or receive the treatment that your symptoms require without all the anxiety that goes with it. As you say we all have to die of something....but we dont have to worry ourselves sick about it.
Your post made me think of a technique that the boxer Mohamed Ali used which is known as the zones of proximity. Ali used this psychological tool to great effect before a fight to remain, calm, relaxed, energised and as a defence against the negative effects of anxiety and stress.
If he let his mind race ahead to losing the fight, losing his title, losing his income, losing his life even, then he would be beaten before he began so he created a series of boundaries or invisible shields which kept him safe.
It worked a little like this....while sitting in his dressing room, hearing the sound of the crowd he wasn't in danger because he wasnt in the ring yet. When he got in the ring he wasn't in harms way because the fight hadn't started yet, when the bell rang he didn't need to worry because his opponent hadn't swung a punch yet...when his opponent swung a punch.... well he hadn't knocked Ali out yet....I'm sure you get the idea Jules.
I dont know whats causing your pain hun but on this forum we all know what is causing our extremely anxious over reactions. I hope you get an appointment with your GP to resolve your health concerns and in the meantime you might find googling some anti stress strategies like the one above helpful.
:)
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Sooby, that's an interesting and helpful response and thank you for that. The private therapist I see is an NLP hypnotherapist and I have started seeing her again. Like a lot of people with health anxiety, I know all the techniques, I just can't get my stupid brain to believe in them. I've had this bout of health anxiety really badly for 3 years now.
Coldethyl, yes, take betablockers, have done for years. Maybe these Sertraline are upsetting my stomach too much. I just don't know. In my area you can have the 12 week session of CBT then you can't have another round until 6 months later. Like you said, if your leg was broken would they leave it half fixed? I am left with having to fund myself if I want therapy. I just can't see me ever getting rid of it now to be honest, it must just be part of my psyche I think. It's all to do with trust and that's my problem....none in doctors or hospitals so illness freaks me out and keeps me in this hell.
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jules,
a good hypnotherapist ( a really good one ) could help. The lack of trust is totally understandable and its perfectly natural to feel the way you do in such circumstances. If we move the hormonal stuff to one side then any extreme anxiety or phobia type reaction could be attributed to your subconscious trying to keep you safe. It's a normal, reaction that sometimes goes into overdrive.
Imagine being single and buying a dog to make you feel safe only to find out that it becomes so protective that it stops you meeting the man of your dreams :D
Hypnotherapy can be a useful tool in accessing the creative subconscious mind and encouraging it to find new and more effective ways to keep you safe.
Just a thought...... :-\
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Hi JJ
I hope you are feeling better today. You might remember I mentioned my own fears about pancreatic cancer on CKLD's 'anxiety and happiness' thread last week. I've been getting pains that move around the rib cage and back area for three years and been convinced it is C. I get the pains that come and go and move about, one Dr told me if the pains move about it is not C, but like you I don't believe a word they say ;). It is likely to be costochondritis - fancy name for inflammation of the ribs probably caused by my dreadful posture and computer mouse, but I have also tracked it on a day-by-day basis and is definitely worse at certain times of what was monthly cycle (am peri so all over the place), so probably influenced by low oestrogen?? It is also worse when I stop daily computer use, so on holidays or days off. I think the muscles are not used to being in different positions or uses, there are loads of muscles all round the back and rib cage. Costo can also give you indigestion type problems, it does with me.
You can get out of this, you know. Don't think that it will have to rule your life forever. Others have mentioned getting some more help, I hope you can do this. I'm still taking one day at a time and doing my meditating app, but have now been OK for 17 days, pretty much a record for me.
Take care
BB
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Morning BooBoo and any other ladies on here.
Thank you so much for your responses, you really do help, especially when I get myself into stupid mode and start catastrophising. I just couldn't bear the thought that something else was starting on top of everything else and it really upset me as it then detracts from me trying to concentrate on getting sorted and coping with the new meds. Sat with a hot water bottle most of the evening which helped. Was still bad in bed but okay if stayed on right side so when it was still there this morning had a good talk to myself and took a diazepam and it's eased off. I even said to my OH "guess what, I've got a new illness - pancreatic cancer etc." just so I could hear myself say it out loud and obviously he told me off and called me stupid but it helped to voice it.
I am already seeing a private therapist again but as Coldethyl says on another thread about her therapy, the problem is that you can't believe that this will work and so automatically there is a stumbling block I need to get over. I certainly hope something works because I can't see a happy future for me if it doesn't but I've been like this for so long I can't remember not having it now as if it's just become me.
Thank you for all your responses - I really, really do appreciate them all. x
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Sparkle, that's brilliant - so pleased for you. Isn't it wonderful when you get that feeling that everything is good for a change. I think it will be a combination of the meds and the fact that yes, when it's been going on for so long, you just think "oh for goodness sake, just do your worst", which funnily enough, is exactly what I did this morning driving to work. I am so heartily sick of feeling like this and having this HA so I thought right, enough. I can't believe it but I've actually walked the very small distance to the shops in my lunch hour as I had to go and get a present for somebody here (really didn't want to go....) and I told myself all the way "you are well, you are happy and you can do anything you physically want to do" and hey I've done it and I've congratulated myself! I was reading NLP affirmations earlier on the internet and thought what have I got to lose and if you repeat them to yourself in a positive "it is happening now" manner, they are supposed to infiltrate into your subconscious and do some good so I'm going to really try and do it.
Guess what - since I've been panicking about my rib and back pain - I've had no chest aches!!! :beat:
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Hi Justjules
I felt I had to post here (although I don't normally post in detail about my health niggles and pains) - because I recently had EXACTLY THE SAME SYMPTOMS! As you say it is not just a normal pulled muscle - it is the strangest but very characteristic pain associated with indigestion type feelings but also muscular. I have had this before from time to time and each time it happens I worry.
I have had it in my central back but it is associated with sort of belching ie if I move by back I get belching (I can't burp!). It will last a couple of days and then disappear. I had exactly this about 10 days ago. It just came on suddenly in the night and lasted for two days. It was my upper left back and it was so painful it woke me in the night. It hurt when I breathed too, as well as tucking in sheets, and even putting a tampon in was painful (was having a withdrawal bleed at the time, and I'm left-handed!) Whenever I moved my back it hurt and also the belching - but not normal indigestion and not normal muscle pain ( I do exercise classes). Like you I could only find pancreatic cancer as the cause - and I have found this previously.
I said on a previous thread I try to keep my inner hypochondria at bay and rarely share any health fears and worries but because of your posts I felt I had to because it sounds like the same thing. Mine was on the left - hence the worry. I didn't go the doctor because it's gone now. Mine is always associated with extreme tiredness/fatigue as well. My husband said it couldn't be PC otherwise I would have jaundice - but would need to be advanced for that! Bettyboo he also came up with costochondritis - which I've looked at before, and also another one is coxsackie B virus which can cause Pleurodynia (the chest pain) - although I didn't have fever etc.
I have no idea what caused mine and what has done in the past but it's not a simple pulled muscle nor is it normal indigestion where pains occur but then pass through. It was only localised to that area.
That probably doesn't help - but maybe to show that others have had it too - I still don't know whether mine was due to anything serious - but I won't do anything about it......
Hurdity x
PS I don't need therapy!
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Thanks Hurdity - that's reassuring. Typically though, being a health anxiety nut, I have just attached myself to the thought that OMG, this could be just the early stages then....I will now be checking my eyeballs for yellowing and skin :-\
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Mine is not in my ribs, but I have had back ache for about 2 weeks - also wakes me at night, and I cant move in a morning without a few yoga stretches - I have blamed the mattress and my granddaughter (standing nursing her), but I did wonder if it was the Setraline? going to ask GP next week. Might be tmi but bowels are not great either. I dont normally suffer from HA, but have had a back of mind fear it might be something bad and I really should mention it to GP. Also had a few bouts of indigestion which since taking probiotics I had not suffered from for some time, now have gaviscon and other indigestion remedies to hand.
Could be the AD's then? My appointment is next Wednesday so will try remember to update when I ask GP.
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Justjules - that's brilliant - well done to you! That is so interesting, I think that's a bit like I've been feeling - I'm still here despite all the googling and worst case scenarios I've put myself into over the years. Enough is enough!!
Oh, and I did have to smile about the worry shifting to another symptom - that's EXACTLY what happens to me - I seem to chase them round my body. And I always think I'm doing really well when I only have one symptom on the go instead of two or three - that really is a result!!
Have a good afternoon!
S x
I know what you mean by shifting from symptom to symptom....... :-\
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I read sooby's post with interest. I saw a hypnotherapist, who worked with Paul McKenna as well, for different reasons. I only saw him for 1 session, but have been benefitting ever since.
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Hi Justjules....I think this pain is digestion related due to your lack of appetite and the stress hormones raging. Also stomach acids being disrupted. I've had similar, I also get biliary colic which is pain under right rib with referred pain to right shoulder blade. I've had the tests and no gallstones etc. With regards to health anxiety I just tell myself now I'm not going to "what if" I'm not going to worry as I've worried enough! Live in the moment and if something bad happens I'll deal with it and not feel any worse than what I've already been through. Big hugs!!
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Hi Sparkle yes I get IBS too. Just recently before I went back on my AD's my IBS was really bad. I felt so ill and was at the dr every week. I felt so nauseous, abdo pain, no appetite. The dr just said it was due to anxiety, not one of them actually mentioned IBS, I thought there was something seriously wrong as I felt so ill. It was all depression, luckily the nausea is gone now. It just shows how the brain and gut are related.
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I am like Sparky and my IBS is definitely not confined to my colon although acute episodes cause intense cramping in that area. However nausea, heartburn, acid indigestion, spasms and burbling in the oesophagus (which I know are not oesophageal cancer despite the symptoms being the same as my mother had) and sharp RH abdo pain (which have never turned into appendicitis ::)) are all symptomatic of IBS disturbance I believe.
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Hi JustJules - I just wanted to say that our imaginations can and do run riot and it's awful isn't it. I try to do my CBT as well. Is the pain unusual for you? Is it getting worse? Are the symptoms serious? When I answer 'I don't know' to the third question, that is usually when my mind goes over and over things and my imagination has a field day.
It is so hard to know when to act and when to wait? Hopefully you are feeling better today and maybe with less anxiety you can work out if you need to do something or whether you can wait to see how things go. x
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Just Jules,
Another sufferer of rib to back pain reporting for duty. Also HA. Mine has been ongoing on/off for a year plus. I did actually have one doctor ask me, "Have you been consulting with Dr Google?" After I tearfully relayed my symptoms and fears. Needless to say, I was quite embarrassed. He told me whilst Google can be helpful at times, it does not see your whole picture and should not be relied upon for a diagnosis. And still it's hard not to Google when my HA is at its worst! I've had my appendix removed and sometimes I think it is phantom pain from that. I guess I take comfort in knowing other ladies have these same bouts of discomfort and are still here to tell the tale. All I know is since turning 40 a few years ago, my body experiences much more aches and pains than it ever did and my dr visits occur with greater frequency. Mostly to be told there's nothing wrong with me. :P