Menopause Matters Forum
Menopause Discussion => Other Health Discussion => Topic started by: kerrieann on June 27, 2013, 07:59:00 PM
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totally gutted today went to see doc weeks ago about this terrible pain in my lower back and groin explained that its been going on for months also pain in right shoulder sent me for xrays an ive been waiting for today to come to see the orthopedic doc at hospital for some answers only to find when i got there he only deals with arm and shoulder nothing to do with back or hips etc so now i dont know whats gone on as i dont have any other appointments rang the sugery and i can go see a doc tomorrow (not mine) to find out why i havent been refered for my back and hips at the hospital today i have blood tests for rhuematoid arthritis which they said my doc should have done my doc was talking to me about hip replacement and all sorts when i went so i know i havent dreamt it i think he forgot to refer me for my hips and back and just did the shoulder one soo fed up know as was hoping to book a weeks holiday and now probably got to wait for more appointments sorry for going on just fed up x kerrie
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What a shame, you must be really down about this. It just makes you feel like a number instead of a person.
Did the consultant you saw say anything about your shoulder at all.
Hope you get an answer when you visit your GP tomorrow. Book your holiday. You normally get plenty of notice and if the dates clash you can always change the appointment.
We all need a break away.
Honeyb
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honey bun yes i felt a bit stupid to be fair i did think maybe i had forgotten to do the choose and book for the other consultant but ive had the paperwork out and no it was just 1 i had to do so iam not that crazy ;D the consultant said that he thinks i have torn a tendon which they could operate on ??? i was expecting frozen shoulder or arthritis but i have to go for an ultra sound on monday and then see him again dont fancy an operation its my hips that are causing the most pain i cant walk properly but will see him in 6 weeks and take it from there x kerrie
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I don't think it's been your fault at all.
Is it possible that you would need to see two different specialists and your appointment/referral to see someone about your hip pain is in the pipeline.
Just a thought.
Honeyb
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i dont think so i only had the 1 appointment to book you do it youself at our doctors they give you a ref no and you ring yourself and book and when i saw the consultant today he told me that these days consultants deal with only specific areas such as arms back hips knees feet etc so he explained it may be one consultant for my back and another for my hips :-\ heaven knows i hope i get some clarity tomorrow at gp i dont expect she will admit that my gp didnt do the referral for the other consultants but we will see x kerrie
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I've done choose and book so I know what you mean. Doesnt sound like it was your mistake at all. Hope dr can sort it for you ASAP. Not good being left in pain like that.
Hugs
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iam annoyed to be fair i think i will have to go through the whole procedure of choose and book and the waiting time again and in the meantime iam trying to manage on paracetamol for the pain as i cant walk for more than 15 mins o well see hat tomorrow brings i cant do much about it :)
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Totally unbelievable about Orthopaedic Consultants only dealing in areas of the body, last time I looked all the bones and joints are interconnected! and what about referred pain.
So sorry you have to go through this kerrieann, I know how you are feeling, I am still waiting to see Consultant and what you have said has not given me much confidence, I went to see an Osteopath on Tuesday and he would not give treatment until I had seen a Consultant to find out what was causing my problem, he told me to take ibuprofen for five days to bring down inflammation and charged me £30 to tell me this.
I really hope you get an appointment soon x
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off to see the gp at 1.30 see will let you know what she says x kerrie
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hi all been to see lady gp regards the mix up and what she is telling me is that my xrays showed no hip problems but a problem with degeneration at the bottom of my back and she tells me that is why my gp didnt refer me only for the shoulder problem, she also asked about blood tests i told her i had them yesterday at hospital so know i have to ring the consultants secretary and ask her to fax the results through to my gp i dont even know where his secretary is based :-\ the gp has now booked me for physio and awaits the blood test results she has given me painkillers 15/500 co codamol. It wasnt till i got out that i realized the day i saw my gp he told me to get a form for choose and book to see the consultant re my hip/back pain and shoulder however the xray results didnt come through for a week so he couldnt have looked at them and decided i didnt need to see a consultant as the lady gp told me today. so now i have to do with painkillers and see what good physio does has anyone any experience of physio for back problems ?
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Kerieann I am seeing a Physio in fact I saw her this afternoon, they are not so hands on as they use to be but will give you a sheet with exercises to do at home, I also had ultrasound treatment for about five mins. I must confess that it has not made much difference.
My physio has referred me to a Consultant and she said today that she will chase this up.
She told me again today that my problem is mechanical and in my sacrolilliac joints more so on the left. My Xrays came back as satisfactory and no change since I last had one in 2007, though Xrays don't show up tissue problems.
She also said Consultant might consider injection, I don't know if this would be considered for you. Most people have some degeneration in lower back and don't have pain others do.
Sounds to me that you have not had the best of treatment and there has been a lack of communication and some back peddling I would go back and see your own GP.
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Sounds like lack of communication, however, for an Orthopaedic Consultant to see 'only' one part of the skeleton amazes me :o and if the records/appt. dept. had read the referral letter correctly, they should have contacted you to let you know! If you got as far as this particular Consultant why couldn't he have referred you to the correct Dept.? :-\
As mentioned, how about referred pain ......... everything should inter-connect after all!
Physio should help. Exercises, lifting correctly can help enormously - as can footwear ;)
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yes i think its all about lack of communication i havent really got the energy to go back and take it up with the gp as they will probably cover for one another anyway so i will see how the physio goes gp told me today to carry on with walking and just to take pain killers and i wont be causing any damage so they know best :-\ she said it sounds like nerve pain coming from the bottom of my back really dont know now feel iam no further forward kerrie
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Walking can ease painful joints and muscles. If you take pain relief before attempting anything strenous, i.e. lifting, it will kick in before you require it.
See what the physio suggests ;)
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thanks clkd i suppose i was expecting to know what was causing the problem and then set about trying to put it right i didnt really want to mask things with pain relief but like you say i will see what the physio thinks at least i know one thing was right and that was the chiropractor said there was no problem with my hips and that it was my back kerrie
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Hip pain is ALWAYS felt in the groin.
Back pain can radiate from the neck downwards dependant on which area is affected, there can be radiation of pain to the various muscle groups and I have sciatica at night with burning down my thighs >:( which is never troublesome in the day.
We evolved upright - now the best evoloutionary idea ::)
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in the groin thats where the pain is when i walk for more than 15 mins oh heaven knows where its coming from feeling rather more confused than normal and that aint good ;)
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I wonder what was in the referral letter from your GP? You were expecting to speak to the Consultant about one issue, could it be possible that your GP mentioned some other part of the spine?
I would ring the Orthopaedic Secretary and ask what was in the referral letter. It seems strange that a Consultant only deals with one part of the spine - the one I worked for had an interest in hand surgery so his first Clinic on a Monday morning was for those who had done silly things over the weekend - i.e. put their hand in front of a lawn mower :-X .......... who had been seen in Casualty and referred to his Clinic. Otherwise he and the other Surgeon dealt with the whole spine etc..
If you send me a PM with the Hospital I will look at the Surgeon's detail to whom you were referred to see whether I can find out exactly what he/she deals with. I am intrigued ;D
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clkd as i said earlier in the thread when i went to gp yesterday she said they had the results of my xrays and there showed no problems in the hips but degeneration of lower spine which she said would be why my gp didnt refer me he only referred me for the shoulder problem although that xray came back as normal ? what i didnt realize till i got home was that the x ray results came a week after i had seen my gp and he had already given me my choose and book form so in fact he must have forgotten to do the referral for my back but no ones going to admit that are they ? i know he was going to refer me as he kept me in there for ages telling me all about hip replacement ! i will message you the consultants name and the hospital x kerrie
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Got your PM and have replied ;) - seems there's a lot of shoulder replacement surgery going on in your area! with visiting Consultants with similar interests ??? ........... technology has advanced so have 'they' forgotten how debilitating low back pain can be! ?
What is your next plan? Perhaps seeing the referral letter might be the way to go? If there are NO problems in your hips or pelvis you will not be requiring a hip replacement any time soon ;) ::) ........... perhaps ringing both hospitals to see whether there is a Consultant who deals with your symptoms? Then you will have a name for your GP to send the letter too ::)
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clkd i sent a pm back to you :)
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<wave> have replied ;)
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update i have been for the ultra sound scan on my shoulder and they told me they can see no tear in the tendons that is what the consultant wanted the scan for so thats not the problem with my shoulder and upper arm.
i also rang the consultants secretary and got her to fax the relults of the blood tests through to my gp (dont know why i had to do seems like alot of diy going on ) any way i rang my surgery and what she told me is that the doctor had seen the results of the blood tests and now wants me to have further blood tests in 2 weeks time,so now iam stressing :( if there was nothing wrong why would he want repeat tests in 2 weeks surely they showed either something or nothing can anyone shed any light please as its worrying me. kerrie
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It could be raised white blood cell count. They often repeat a blood test for that.
It's caused by inflammation and your shoulder/hip could be causing that.
If it was anything really serious they would not wait for two weeks.
You can ask why and they would have to tell you the reason.
I know it's easy for me to say but try not to worry.
Honeyb
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thanks honey b i keep telling myself that if it were anything much they wouldnt wait for 2 weeks to repeat the blood tests but i just cant think of a good reason for wanting more tests so soon :(
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Give them a ring to ask? These medics know what they know but don't often know - nor have the sense to - inform the patient >:(
How are you generally?
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just anxious i suppose its the not knowing why he wants more blood tests thats bothering me i my opinion there either clear or not :-\ what can change in 2 weeks ? thanks for asking clkd x kerrie
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hi all, been to see my gp today re. my back and hip problem and he has given me a copy of the referral letter he sent which asks for me to be seen for my shoulder and hips/lower back that was on 4th june he told me to ring them and ask why i was only referred to the one consultant so now i have to try and sort it out in the morning :( i seem to be having to sort alot myself.
when asked about wanting more blood tests in 2 weeks he read the results and just said that my levels (for arthritis) were not at all high in fact lower than his and he feels that my hip pain must be coming from my lower back and so now i have to wait to see the other consultant
feels like a right mess to me and now i probably have to wait weeks to be seen.
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At least you have the answer! Blood tests 'within normal limits for arthritis' ......... so to make sure that there isn't inflammation which could probably cause the blood levesl to alter, he is repeating them.
When you get the appt. sorted make sure that you are seeing the Consultant most interested in your symptoms ;)
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clkd yes at least now i know it wasnt my gp who made a mistake, thankfully, as it would worry me if it had been him :)
anyway just got to sort out why they didnt do the full referral as requested by my gp that will be interesting ;)
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hi all ive rang this morning to find out what happened to my second consultant appointment for lower back and hips and hips and i am almost speechless and so frustrated i gave them the choose and book no and everything they needed and they say iam not on there system and have not booked an appointment through them for anyone :angryfire: i went on to explain that i have already seen the one consultant for my shoulder so how did i get there ? cutting a long story short they said there was nothing they could do,
i have just rung my gp and asked them nicely if they wouldnt mind sorting this damn mess out
sorry for the rant but iam fuming iam the sitting here in pain waiting for appointments that are not going to happen. kerrie
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Let's hope that the referral hadn't reached them and that the GP can liaise so that you don't have to wait too long! It seems a strange systme that the patient self-refers .......... OK if you have seen the Consulant previously but even so :-\ ???
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still no news from the gp who is meant to be sorting out this mess :( apparently when i rang them today they are still trying to sort it out and asked me to call back on wednesday seems ridiculous to me.
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Hi Kerrieann - just to say I had hip pain which was caused by my lower back problems so that could be what is happening with you. Mine was eventually traced (after several years) to arthritis and degenerative disc disease which in turn was causing sciatica, one part of which was a really painful hip.
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catdude they seem to have established that i have degeneration in lower back but blood tests show no arthritis but it certainly feels like sciatica that awful throbbing type pain in my hips so this is what i am thinking that a nerve is trapped just hope they get to the bottom of it getting sick of it now cant walk far at all and it sets it off kerrie
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Kerrie still waiting for an appointment to see Consultant, its been over a month now since my Physio said she would refer me, nothing through the post yet, will give it another day and the ring surgery and see what they can suggest.
When the weather is hot and humid as it is now, it cause body swelling for me including feet and hands and it has made my lower left back hip and leg seem to ache more especially in the evening and when I go to bed. The swelling has gone by the morning and once I get up and have a bath it feels OK. I have been using freeze gel and its good for lower back and hot feet and ankles.
Walking in very hot and humid weather can cause problems even for some who don't have mechanical problems.
Do hope you hear something soon.
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I don't think there is a blood test to check for osteo arthritis, what they are probably saying is that you don't have rheumatoid arthritis.
DH is supposed to be referring himeself to physio - why not give the Dept a ring Silverlady - could you take a cancellation appt.?
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yes i think the blood tests were for r. arthritis, so how do they test for another type ?
i have also been using a freeze gel and found it good but its so expensive and i have been using it 4 times a day, i bought mine from the chiropractor and i wonder if cheaper ones work the same ?
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Bag of frozen peas is just as good!
X-rays will tell how badly any joint has deteriorated during natural wear and tear. Also the way a joint moves or whether there is crepitus (noise) on movement ........ your GP/Consultant should have moved all your joints/muscle groups ........ to find out exactly which bits hurt the most and where there is any lack of movement. Physio ought to be able to teach you to move correctly, we all get into bad habits ::)
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clkd, after reading your post it has dawned on me that my gp has never examined me at all ? i remember years ago being examined all the time maybe they are not soo hands on now i dont know
I did have all the xrays on my back but as you know iam still waiting to see a consultant and maybe he will examine me. kerrie
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There are certain limb movements that can show how much stiffness a patient has developed. Within those movements can determine the next 'step' in treatment. Let us know how you get on! Could you take a cancellation appt. if offered? If so ring the Consultant's secretary and make the suggestion.
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the surgery are trying to sort out the original referral so they tell me :-\ rather than re. refer, but the referral letter which asked for me to been seen re. shoulder, hips and back and i saw the consultant for my shoulder 2 weeks ago so i don't know why the 'just start again, i will give it this week to see if i get any joy. kerrie
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How's the pain in the meantime?
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Have chased up my referral, it is in the system, but I won't be seeing an orthopaedic Consultant as apparently there is a shake up in the system and Consultants don't want to see patients unless its for surgery. This seems an odd situation as how would they know unless they actually see a patient and access what is wrong with them ???
I was told in phone call that it would be classed as pain management now and as yet they don't know who I will be seeing. I still have not had a diagnosis of what is causing the problem and Xray showed no degeneration in lumber region. I am sure if they suggest an injection, a consultant would have to authorise a MRI to see where the area is that is causing the symptoms.
This all seems a mess I have been trying to sort this back pain out for over six months now and to find out what is causing it, its all very depressing.
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WHAT! :o ..... general practitioners went into Surgery to provide a service for patients at root level, referring to the various Specialisities as and when necessary. Years ago injections were given, long before MRI was available. If into the hip under general anaesthetic.
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At the moment I give up CLKD and I know how Kerrie is feeling. It seems to me that back pain is very poorly managed on the NHS and it is something that can easily take away quality of life.
I know if I went private I would probably have had it sorted out by now but I can't afford, its only OH who is has BUPA.
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silver lady, i think we are in a similar position in that neither of us know what is causing the problems, it sounds ridiculous in this day and age doesn't it.
clkd the pain is there all the time so i generally just potter around the house and garden sitting as and when, i gave up walking the dog and when other half takes him twice a day i really gets me down cause i am stuck in the house but if i go then my hips seem to freeze up and it will make the pain worse.
I go to the supermarket about 3 times a week and just about manage walking round there but haven't walked around town for ages :(
Not sure which post i asked this question on, but should i be taking pain relief every 4 hours to get it in my system ? i generally take something when it hurts alot then try to cope without. kerrie
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How about trying pain relief every 4 hours for 5-6 days? Some over the counter meds have relaxants in too but can't remember which one ::) but a Pharmacist could give advice. It may ease symptoms to have a maintenance dose and if you were able to move 'better' you might find it helps overall.
I hate that old woman walk first thing in the morning >:( ........ out of bed bent over, then take a while to straighten up :cuss:
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well i got a call today from the surgery to say that what had happened was my gp wrote to the consultant who specializes in arm and shoulder problems and asked him to see me, but in the same letter he asked for me to be seen re my back and hips and apparently this part was ignored as that is not his field ??? i would have thought that someone with some common sense would have contacted my gp and told him he need to refer me to another consultant re back or is common sense not used these days ?
The receptionist then tried to get me to come next week and tell the gp what she had told me, i kept my calm and asked if there was any need for me to come and tell him when he was in the next room to her and that i would be wasting an appointment which someone else may need, she agreed with me so now i will wait for them to let me know if he has referred me to a back consultant :-\ perhaps he will send me to an eye specialist next and ask him to look at my back ;D ;D
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Kerrie keeping my fingers crossed for you.
I have given up for the moment with NHS and am going back to complementary treatment, have an appointment on Monday.
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I was over hearing a lady this morning in our Surgery trying to make an appt for 4-5 week's time, because our GP had told her to do so: apparently 'the book doesn't go that far' >:(
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sometimes if i didn't laugh i'd cry :)
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Hi Kerrieann
I have had back pain problems for years.
In the past five years, I got to the point I could hardly walk 500 yards with the back and hip pain. I could not turn over in bed with the pain in my hips and thighs.
I was referred to a specialist, had blood tests and MRI. I was also diagnosed as having degenerative lower spine. I was offered injections into my spine, and amitriptylene (sp).
I decided to try other things first.
I have had a combination of physiotherapy with acupuncture; chiropractic; and myofascial massage. I found the chiropractic and myofascial massage great. I had a physiotherapist who specialised in myofascial massage. I now have a therapeutic massage by a local person. I understand that when our back is out or weaker, that the muscles can adjust and numb fingers can start with a lower back problem.
I do not have a strong back - but I know I need to do special core exercises to improve that. I also understand that muscles adapt to our body being misaligned and it can manifest itself long term in other areas.
I understand that some people prefer osteopath to chiropractic and I have used both, as well as physiotherapists.
For me, regular adjustments and the deep tissue massage have been fantastic.
I do know that it is ongoing maintenance though.
PS: I can walk for miles now and would be able to walk longer if I was fitter :-).
Fx
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firewalker, this sounds exactly like me i have given up trying to walk for more than 15 mins as my hips feel like they are locking up and then i will suffer for days :( if i potter around the house and garden its not too bad but anything more and i am in pain.
My problem seems very much as yours ie degeneration in lower spine so where do i start ? i was seeing a chiropractor and after about 8 sessions it helped a little but i still felt the same if i walked far so i gave up what do you recommend ?
Basically i just want to be able to walk as normal again, last year on a weeks holiday i was walking 10 mins then having to sit for 10 mins, not good. I don't want to live on painkillers as they make me tired and spaced out so probably don't want to do much anyway, that's no life. kerrie
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I think I would find it a lot easier if I could get a diagnosis and at least I would know what I was dealing with as nothing showed in my Xray. I think I need an MRI to see what is going on, I thought seeing a specialist would decide this, but it looks as if I won't get that far.
Mine problems only on one side and at the bottom of my spine, my Xray results-
" Normal appearance to the vertebral bodies. Alignment and vertebral body height is maintained throughout"
Can anyone tell me if I had degeneration of the lower spine would it show on the Xray and would I have been told ? perhaps CLKD would know.
I still think its my sacro liiac joint, and is treated on the NHS with an injection.
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They have told me that my x ray showed degeneration of lower spine, if it helps kerrie
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Thank you Kerrie that does help :-* though they did not Xray my hip at least I don't think they did, just the lumber region.
I did show the results to the useless osteopath ( I asked for a copy from my surgery) he looked at it and said ( In other words there is nothing wrong with you) I have kicked him into touch ::)
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Numb fingers are unlikely to be affected by lower lumbar degeneration. From what I remember ??? finger problems stem from the cervical spine ......... or trapped nerve behind the elbow or carpal tunnel disease.
Massage gives a feeling of well being. If one can relax then the symptoms will be less. I wish I could relax like a cat is able to ::)
Managing pain is important. If I am going to do something strenuous then I take Nurofen within an hour of the activity. If I get pain after I take it immediately. Walking eases any low back pain .......
X-ray will show evidence of degeneration in the bones. It won't show muscular problems though. Ask what was requested on the X-ray form? Usually lower back X-ray will include hips and pelvis. Hips being the large round joint within the socket, pelvis the bit the waist sits upon. Remember too that supportive footwear is important and that the spine will compensate if areas are stiff and/or painful, therefore putting stress on muscles we don't realise we own ::)
Go the Library and have a look for the Dorling Kindersley anatomy book - I refer to our very large copy often!
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silverlady, when i was sent for x rays they did my back and then i had to lie on my sides so they could do the hips and pelvis, i was told that my hips and pelvis were ok but i had degeneration of lower spine.
It seem odd to me that most of my pain is in the hips when walking, so it must be referred pain, I think :-\
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It probably is referred pain kerrieann as i have already said i have a curved spine and pelvis which i never knew about until last year my right leg is now shorter than my left and i walk wonky. Its very painful if i walk any distance and they say i am to old to do anything about it ( the joys of getting old and decrepit). They have now sent me to see a pain shrink can't spell the other word and he has helped me the most just by listening as i got so depressed by it all now on ADs and HRT.
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Hip pain is in the groin.
Low back pain is over the area we call the hips ........ those muscles can feel tight too which gives soreness. Sciatica can add to the pain and stiffness .........
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clkd, about this hip and groin pain i am getting i noticed last night when lying on my side that if i press my hand on my hip joint it feels really sore, do you think that could be inflammation ?
I have been using ice but only on the bottom of my back and its not really helping, do you think i should try putting ice packs on my hips ? kerrie
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That could be muscular rather than boney? My 'hips' feel sore, that's sciatica when I've been laying still for too long and it does wake me >:( ......... the pain deep inside seeps into my dreams and I struggle through until I'm awake so that I can move about. You could try a bag of frozen peas on the painful area?
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clkd, i have awful pain all day today, from my hip down to my ankle, feels like damn toothache, throbbing.
I have tried an ice pack on the bottom of my back but that did nothing, i haven't done much at all today so i have no idea whats brought it on, any ideas ? kerrie x
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Hi Kerriann
I read back that you had been to a chiro 8 times and with only a limited improvement.
When I walked before and now if my back is out, I feel as if I my hips are in a vice or solid box and my hip movement is limited.
I recognise the pain you refer to when pressing your hip joint. My thighs (outer in particular) is is painfully sensitive. However, I am trying to remember exactly what the consultant said - along the lines of the problem with the degenerative lower part of my spine causing it to irritate the nerves that run along the sacroiliac and to the hips and down (not exactly right - but think of the principle).
Have you tried proper stretching or yoga exercises? That was highly recommended by my chiro. The spray magnesium I use also helps relax the muscles.
I don't think there is an easy answer or a quick one much as it would be nice it there was. It did take time and it is ongoing, which is not cheap, although now I go to the chiro maybe every month or two just to keep in line.
The problem is, a long term mis-alignment cannot be fixed quickly, unfortunately. It takes time to re-adjust.
Oh - I have just remembered. My cousin's wife highly recommended a backpain book to me a fewmonths ago. Why and how did I forget that??? Anyway, she had been told her back was not 'fixable' and she would be in pain for the rest of her life and so needed drugs etc. Anyway, she heard of the book followed it completely and says she has no issues at all now. She walked the West Highland Way on two occasions - and that is no mean feat!
Let me find the name of the book and I will post it - might be helpful to other sufferers too.
Fx
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Will be grateful Firewalker for the book title :)
Had to cancel my appointment this morning for massage and manipulation, as OH has just taken car into the garage, after our trip yesterday, a neighbour noticed the front under covering of the car was hanging off, he managed to unscrew it and then said the fan belt needed replacing.
Hoping to reschedule appointment.
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::) ..........
my sciatica sometimes runs down the outside of my thigh to the ankle or foot, missing the calf area. Sometimes my lower back aches, like this morning when I was sorting out the chickens' grub - lifting a sack carefully I thought ::) - it's easy for me to do something without thinking it through :-\
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This information is helpful
http://www.uptodate.com/contents/low-back-pain-in-adults-beyond-the-basics
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thanks all, i have been thinking this morning ::) for the past 6 days i have taken a water tablet ( bendroflumethazide) every day, its taken for blood pressure along with olmesartan, normally i take it every other day as it drops my blood pressure too much, with it being so hot i have been sweating more than normal, and i was reading that being dehydrated can defiantly cause joint pain, i remember the chiropractor telling me drink lots of water as well.
So basically 2 questions, am i defeating the object taking a water tablet to remove water, which lowers blood pressure an then upping my intake of water for other health issues :-\
Second question has anyone else heard of dehydration causing joint pains.
Do hope someone replies as i would love to think that upping my water would help with these damn pains.
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Found this for you Kerrie
http://www.waterbenefitshealth.com/symptoms-of-chronic-dehydration.html
My joint pain is worse though in hot humid weather when my body retains water.
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silverlady, thanks for that, i just can't get my head around the blood pressure thing, if i am given water tablets ie diuretics, to remove water, to lower blood pressure, then i drink a healthy amount of water which everyone says is good, then isn't it cancelling out the tablets ??
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I think you must talk to your GP about that Kerrie.
You are taking a blood pressure pill and a diuretic which both lower blood pressure, and your Doctor must have had a reason to prescribe these two drugs.
I don't think anyone is qualified on MM to give advice about this.
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You need to keep drinking water Kerrie to keep hydrated especially in this hot weather. Drink when you are thirsty.
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yes silverlady , i am trying to drink more water, as i don't drink an awful lot and after reading that not drinking enough water can cause joint pain, i decided to drink more, that's when i wondered if the diuretics would just remove the extra water anyway, so it wouldn't help my joints :-\
I will speak to my doctor when i next go and ask him to explain.
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Why would being dehydrated cause joint pain?
With regards taking in enough liquid per 24 hours: check your urine colour!
The first P of the morning will be dark. The next ones should be straw coloured = hydrated. Any lighter and it's too much. We often forget that we take in liquids in many 'forms' during the day, more so in the Winter probably. But TOO much can be fatal.
Also pinching the skin on the back of the hand is a 2nd-ary indicator ...........
Do you need blood pressure tablets? You may have White Coat Syndrome!
Time to have a chat with your Practice Nurse or GP.
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I was told by a chiropractor and so was a friend, that if we do not drink enough water and get dehydrated it will affects the joints :-\
I do have white coat syndrome if my blood pressure is taken in surgery or hospital it's really high, but a home its ok as long as i take 10mg olmectec daily and a diuretic every other day. This i what i asked earlier, as its been so hot and i have been sweating such alot i wondered if i was dehydrated and if that was why i have had alot more pain in the last few days.
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Well I beg to differ ;-)
What colour has your urine been? You don't need to share here ;) but keep an eye on it ..........
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clkd, I have kept an eye on urine through today ;D ;D doesn't sound right does it, anyway it was as you say dark this morning and got lighter throughout the day, so that sounds ok :-\.
When you say you beg to differ what exactly do you mean ? that dehydration would not cause joint pain?
I have been drinking a little extra water throughout the day and have just been to tesco for a few bits only 15 mins and my hip,groin and down to my knee is throbbing :( it does feel like nerve pain to me but i really dont know. kerrie
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It certainly sounds painful and must limit your daily activities >:( - I wonder if Ben Goldacre has any info on whether drinking more will ease joint pains ......... or have a look at the rheumatoid web-site?
It sounds a bit mumbo-jumbo to me ;)
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clkd, the blood tests that i had several weeks ago showed no rheumatoid a so is it still worth looking on that site?
What is the difference in the types of arthritis ? i really don't know
It really feels like a nerve pain, a few months back it was the other leg, so i really am wondering if it is trapped nerves, coming from the bottom of my back, which is where the x rays showed some degeneration but i don't know what to do about it if it is sciatica type problem?
Oh well maybe i will here something soon about seeing a back specialist :)
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Hi Kerrieann - osteo arthritis is wear and tear on the joints http://www.arthritisresearchuk.org/arthritis-information/conditions/osteoarthritis.aspx
Rheumatoid Arthritis is an entirely different type of illness and is an autoimmune disorder which affects your whole body rather than just giving joint pain http://www.arthritisresearchuk.org/arthritis-information/conditions/rheumatoid-arthritis.aspx
Degeneration can sound scary but often just means wear and tear. I say "just" but, of course, it is painful. I have degeneration in the top part of the spine leading to neck problems. The main treatment is regular painkillers and physio. Painkillers need to be taken regularly in order for the right amount of pain relieving drug to build up in the system. You can, of course, take them now and again to relieve particularly troublesome pain but this wont have a continuous effect on the overall pain.
This link has the recommended treatment for sciatica - I think you have tried cold packs with no success? My husband has always used heat pads when his plays up (too much golf normally) so that might be worth a go? http://www.nhs.uk/Conditions/Sciatica/Pages/Treatment.aspx
Taz x
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hi taz thanks for that, as i said it defiantly feels like nerve pain and i feel it in my groin, hips and sometimes thigh but as it seems to be going from one leg to the other i am thinking it's down to my back and something irritating the nerves . Yes i did use ice packs on my lower back religiously for around 2 weeks but it didn't seem to help, i have tried some tiger balm this morning rubbing it into my hips and lower back, it certainly feels very cooling, but this is only a short term relief thing ?
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It does sound like sciatica to me kerrieann - look at the symptoms http://www.nhs.uk/Conditions/Sciatica/Pages/Symptoms.aspx
Taz x
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:thankyou: for the sciatica link! and the detailed explanation.
Reading as much about the various conditions we suffer with can help give us informed choices ;)
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thanks taz, having read through all the info, it really does sound like sciatica, your say your dh uses heat packs, what does this ice or heat treatment do ? is it just temporary relief, or is it actually healing anything? sorry for all the questions but its not really practical to be using ice or heat every few hours when your trying to get on with life or will this take away the pain if i did it regularly for a few days again?
one more question i have looked at quite a few drugs for nerve pain ie gabapentin do you know anything about them as i am really bad with side effects from drugs.
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If you look at treatments under the link you will find what is best. My husband uses diclofenac plus paracetamol and physiotherapy. Mostly it is kept under control. He has found that without painkillers it doesn't get better. Drugs such as diclofenac reduce the inflammation and so the pressure of the nerve lessens which improves things. Exercise is important but the right type of exercise. The heatpack gives short term relief. Have a good look the treatment option. I would ask your GP to refer you for physio.
Taz x
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Swimming is good too. Breast stroke is non-weight bearing. Skinny dipping anyone ;)
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taz, i cannot take anti inflammatory, 1. i am on blood pressure med and 2. i have a very sensitive stomach.
the gp first gave me tramacet, which when i found out it was tramadol and addictive i was too scared to take, then the middle doseage of paracetamol and codeine which if i take more than 1 dose, spaces me out and i can't think straight .
I sound like i am being awkward i know just wish there was a more natural way to get round this as i really am terrible with meds.
I was told by gp 2 weeks ago that there were sending me for physio, but i am still waiting to here about that along with an appointment for the back specialist.
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Paracetamol is ok then but you do have to take it every day - four doses - in order for it to build up enough in your system. It's no good just taking a couple when the pain is really bad. The diclofenac doesn't affect my husband's stomach but other anti-inflams such as nurofen do. Of course it all depends on whether the upset stomach is more bearable than the back pain - you have to make a choice as to which is worse. Unfortunately you do have to reduce the inflammation in order to get less pain so I'm not sure what to suggest.
Taz x
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Local hospital have just phoned giving me an appointment next Friday to see one of the Orthopaedic Consultant's Team.
I was just saying to OH before phone call that my back has felt better these last two days :o :o and that I was keeping my fingers crossed that it would continue!
I have being doing an exercise that seemed to release something and stop the aching.
Any its not until next week and it could start up again. Feel lucky I have appointment now though.
Kerrie I hope yours come through soon.
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You can get diclofenac gel either on prescription ( you get a big tube) or over counter.
I found that DEEP RELIEF - Ibuprofen and Levomenthol is very good, they are safer and easier on tummy. I also think Pracetamol can help too.
The time release ibuprofen is kinder on the stomach and digestive system and making sure you take with food preferably a sandwich as bread helps to cushion the capsules, a doctor told me this.
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silverlady, guess what , i've just picked a choose and book form from gp. so i have to book an appointment now with the specialist :) slightly annoyed just when i rang the number on the choose and book form to be told they didn't know why i was given their number as they don't deal with orthopedic appointments, but they have given me the correct number to call in the morning, trying not to get angry.
please can you tell me what this exercise is that has helped your back, i am desperate for some relief :( as for the ibuprofen i was told not to take it if i was on blood pressure meds or if i have a sensitive stomach, not sure if using in gel form counts, what do you think ? the same applies to diclofenac we have these pills in the house and it states on them not to use if you have high blood pressure, sensitive stomach or if you smoke, it seems that this applies to all anti inflammatory :(
Taz, as i just explained to silverlady its not that i don't want to have an upset stomach, i would swop that any day for the back pain, it's that i have been told not to take them.
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My box doesn't say that - it says that if you have bleeding in the stomach or a peptic ulcer then you shouldn't use them and also that if you are on certain blood pressure meds then you need to be monitored by the GP but nothing about not smoking.. My husband smokes and has taken voltarol for years when his back plays up. I better mention it to him! :-\
Taz x
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I thought you might ask about the exercise Kerrie and I thought how could I explain but here goes.
I sat on the edge of my bed, turned to the side and bent my leg ( the bad side) and ticked the heel into the top of my leg ( groin) and pressed my thigh down until it was touching the bed, I had the other leg stretched out and touching the floor, I pressed on my knee and thigh down and leaned forward, held for a few seconds and then pulled back, I did this 10 times. it seems to have eased something and last night I was comfortable in bed and have not been for quite sometime.
As for the anti inflammatory gel, I think it is prescribed for those who cannot tolerated the oral form
http://saveyourself.ca/articles/voltaren-gel.php
I still think you should check with your doctor though.
Also I worry about suggesting what works for me to others because we are all different, I think you should wait until you have been assessed by a Physio as to what exercises will suit you, or you could do more harm then good.
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hi taz, i put this ( Voltarol pain-eze tablets (diclofenac) into google and a site called net doctor uk came up with the same info that is on my other half's pack of voltarol, my other half smokes as well and he has taken it :-\
I can't remember how to post a link on here, if you can tell me how i will post it.
Silverlady thanks for the low down on the exercise >:( i will give it a go although very carefully an see how far i can get without it hurting, the chiropractor told me that exercise was fine as long as it didn't hurt so i will let you know :)
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http://www.netdoctor.co.uk/seniors-health/medicines/voltarol-tablets.html ?
Taz x
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Thanks taz, how do you add a link its so much easier sometimes than trying to explain :)
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Kerrie just copy the http webpage that you want to copy , by clicking on it and highlighting it, then copy, you do this by placing cursor on the
highlighted address left click and select "copy" you then "paste" by right clicking on the space on your post where you want the address by doing the same, left click and then selecting "paste"
http://www.computerhelpatoz.com/tips-cutcopypaste.html
Hope this helps Kerrie.
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thanks silverlady, i know how to copy and paste and never thought about doing it that way :) i thought it was more complicated, actually adding a link, perhaps i am not as computer illiterate as i thought i was ;)
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Best site I have found for do it yourself back pain relief.
http://www.do-it-yourself-joint-pain-relief.com/
http://www.do-it-yourself-joint-pain-relief.com/sacroiliac-joint-pain-relief.html#Video1
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thanks Silverlady, i don't have much to do this afternoon so i can sit and read through these sites, did jobs early thinking the sun would be out, so i would sit in the garden, but no sun yet :(
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ok ladies can you dig into your wealth of info and tell me what you think?
re this back hip pains and all the problems i have been having with it, today i checked out the patient leaflet from my blood pressure med. (olmetec) and one of the side effects is back pain and joint pain, so i went to askapatient website which is brilliant, and there where so many reviews of this med. saying they came off it after a few years as they started getting low back pain and heavy aching legs and couldn't walk far with bad pain !
I know i am clutching at straws here but i am getting so desperate as i can not walk far at all without terrible pain.
What are your thoughts ladies ? other half says get to docs and ask for a different blood pressure med.
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There are always side effects from meds. Hubby had to change his because it gave him a tickly cough. Now the one he is on gives him a runny nose. Swings and roundabouts.
Have you had a look on You Tube at specific exercises for sciatica. At the beginning of the year I was in so much pain. I could only go up and down steps sideways. I felt as if I had a huge rubber band from my hips to my knees and it was too short and tight. I did the exercises and it really helped.
Honeyb
X
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thanks honeybun, wouldn't even of thought of looking on tube for exercises, the site that silverlady put in this thread is also very good.
I did ask my gp weeks ago if these back hip pains etc could be a side effect of my blood pressure meds. and he said defiantly not, but when i checked the leaflet these pains are listed on there ?
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Well, ladies i am trying not to get too excited but i went to see an osteopath today and after a lengthy discussion he examined me and after going all down my spine etc and me to say if there was any pain (which there wasn't) he then went from my hip downwards and i could have yelled out it was so sore when he pressed my joint, he believes that it could well be Trochanteric Hip Bursitis , every symptom he inquired about i have got.
As my xrays showed degeneration of the lower spine he said it could be coming from that but he didn't think so, but he has strapped my back up and i have to leave this on for a week, and i have to use an ice pack on both of my hips joints for 15 mins every hour when possible.
I see him again in a week if there is no improvement he thinks the next step may be an injection into the hip.
In case it may help anyone this is the site he gave me to look at Trochanteric Hip Bursitis Symptoms
Trochanteric bursitis pain pattern.
A healthy greater trochanteric bursa is usually about the size of a small plum, but can swell to the size of an orange when bursitis sets in. Other symptoms you may experience include:
Pain around the bursa that may extend down the groin and thigh
Swelling and tenderness in the area of the bursa
Pain my increase when the hip is flexed
Difficulty sleeping due to pain
Limping
The area around the bursa is hot to the touch
Stiffness and tightness in the hip joint, groin and possibly the knee due to a tight muscle (iliopsoas) or tendon (IT band)
Trochanteric Bursitis Treatments
Relieving the symptoms of bursitis initially focuses on keeping the pressure off the bursa and resting your hip. This can be difficult when you have to carry on with daily activities, but resting whenever you can is recommended. During your recovery you will probably have to modify or avoid the activities that stress your bursa until your pain and inflammation settle.
Treatments should involve decreasing swelling, relieving stress on the hip joint, correcting any biomechanical dysfunction (uneven leg length, bone spur, etc.), treating scar tissue, and then restoring strength and movement in your leg and hip. Surgery may be required if your bursa irritation is a result of a bone formation problem, such as a bone spur.
If your bursitis is caused by an infection (septic bursitis), the doctor will drain the bursa sac with a needle and prescribe antibiotics to treat the infection. For non-infectious bursitis, the preliminary treatment starts with non-operative options such as Freezie Wrap® Cold Compression Therapy and Inferno Wrap® Blood Flow Stimulation Therapy™. Blood Flow Stimulation Therapy™ (BFST®) is recommended once inflammation has been calmed to heal the bursa and surrounding tissue faster and reduce the risk of bursitis returning.
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Oh painful. But it is unlikely to be bilateral :-\ and do not allow him to inject you with anything ;)
Ice-packs, feet up, Pimms to hand ? 8)
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yes clkd, he did say that it is very unusual for it to be in both hips, but not unheard of and it is much worse in the right hip, as far as the injection is concerned that would be done at hospital or gp if they do it there.
I have done the ice thing every hour since 12 today and i have to say i am getting very bored , but i am going to stick with for as long as i can and see what happens. kerrie
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I meant to add to my last post re the bursitis that i was very surprised today that when i saw the osteopath, he said that if it was necessary for me to have an mri scan he could arrange it within 1 week and i would be told the results there and then, it would cost £200
I didn't realize it could be so quick and easy if you didn't go through the nhs :o
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Yep. Lots of the machines across the NHS as standing idle from 5.00 p.m. and often other specialisities, including Vets., have access to them. The reason being is, that although machines are available, the NHS won't pay for the Staff .......... these machines should be use 24/7, patients in hospital could then be assessed 'after hours' allowing the machines to be 'free' for out-patient use.
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that is so bad when people are waiting weeks and sometimes months for scans :o
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Although, to be fair, as is the case in our own local hospital the private hospitals can part-fund the machines in the first place. They are used for NHS cases during the day and for private patients during evenings and weekends.
Taz x
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I would like to believe that Private Hospitals make use of NHS equipment out of hours
Did you decide to go private for the scan?
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Well clkd. the osteopath said he didn't think a scan was going to be necessary, as he feels it is Trochanteric Hip Bursitis, he said to use the ice every hour when possible and i see him next Wednesday and we would take it from there.
However i have an appointment with my gp tomorrow so i will tell him what the osteopath has said and get his opinion, i may ask for the injection if there are no signs of improvement by tomorrow afternoon, as i will have been using ice packs religiously for 36 hours and sitting on my backside till it's numb and i am bored to tears ;D.
Am i expecting too much, do you think, too soon with this ice ?
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Inflammation can take a while to disperse in an active joint area. Let us know what your GP suggests! Have you tried a Chillo, might be less of a shock to the area than ice .........
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Chillo, i had mine for about 4 years and it started to leak, i always said i would send for another but never did, i bought it for hot flushes and fingers crossed i don't have them anymore, but it was wonderful and like you say it would be heaven to lie on, may send for another :)
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hi all, seen gp, he agrees with osteopath that it's hip brusitis and that i need an injection, but says i still need to see orthopedic consultant as hip brusitis is caused by back problems, osteopath didn't say that and i have googled and can't find any site which says that :-\ according to gp i should go for the injection through the consultant who will give gas and air, as when they do it without you can hear the screams all over :'( thanks for that i told him.
Any way when i gave the choose and book slip to the receptionist she said why aren't you having this done at our other surgery as it will be much quicker, so i said i leave it up to you and she is going to ring me monday and let me know, my head is a mess don't know what i should do.
Gp also said the ice wouldn't do much and that anti inflammatory gel is a waste of time, he has given me buprenorphine patches, heaven knows how i will react to them, any thoughts here ladies kerrie
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If the injection is into the hip joint it should be done under a General Anaesthetic and yes, I think you should see an Orthopaedic Surgeon. Anyword with 'sis' in means inflammation ........... appendicitis, bursistis ......... and I don't think the back always plays a part in what affects the hip - again an orthopod will tell you what is required.
Did you ask the receptionist who would be doing the injection? It would seem strange that this would be done in a Surgery ??? but ring on Monday to find out?
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yes clkd, i will still be seeing an orthopedic consultant, but according to the receptionist one of the doctors at our other surgery 3 miles away, does these injections, i only know what they told me, so i have to wait till monday when they call.
To be honest i am sick of getting conflicting advice, osteopath telling me that ice can cure it and gp saying it won't and i must say that it does seem to be easing with the ice, having said that i have kept off my feet for 2 days so it could be that :-\ heaven knows but its getting me down now :(
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Not knowing can be a restriction in itself. If the ice is helping use it. It won't do any harm. Resting also helps but we can't rest completely! For example a frozen shoulder kept still will recover in 2 years - but we move, i.e. we breath, sneeze, cough, swallow ............
If you can do, rest. Let us know what you are told on Monday. Often GPs don't like other 'practitioners' involved with their patient. Probably because they won't know exactly what does help: or not ;)
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Feeling very confused today, after 3 days of resting and using ice on my hips things didn't feel too bad, however this morning a neighbor caught me to chat, she is a lovely women but can really talk :) she kept me talking for about 40 mins and since then i have awful low back ache, i haven't felt pain in my back for months and now i am wondering if it is my back that's causing my hip pain :-\ soo confused and if i have this injection into my hip and it's my back and won't cure it will it ?
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Nope. But if you have been resting then you back muscles will become lax. Also this heat makes the body compensate in ways we are not always aware of. Mine hurts occasionally. My legs ache too. Restless legs are a nuisance at night.
Keep up with the ice packs and move around as much as you are able to.
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For you CLKD http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rTPDtYKTZ1c
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:thankyou: never heard of that particular area .......... periformus? Off to do more googling ;)
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hi all, update on the back, hip problem, had a cancellation today with a physiotherapist at local hospital, she was very thorough, checked everything from feet up to neck.
She said on my notes i had some arthritis in hip and lower back, some degeneration of lower back.
The first thing she asked was how long have i been wearing orthotic sandals, i told her i had found them out as i haven't worn them for about 5 years when i had plantar fascilitis, and she said that i must wear them all the time as my feet roll inwards, which in turn throws my knees inwards, then my hips which pulls my back out.
She took her shoes off and showed me the insole she was wearing, told me to get some for my normal shoes, as her feet are the same.
Basically after examination she said that all my muscles had locked up tightly and that i have to do stretching exercises for 2 weeks and she will see me then and see how things are when the muscles are free.
Not sure what to make of it all but i will be doing the exercises and see what happens.
Any thoughts ladies ??
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What are your thoughts? Sounds like she knows her stuff. Did she suggest swimming as a non-weight bearing exercise?
Take off your shoes and draw round your feet on a sheet of paper - then look to see how your feet splay/? ........ and please DO the exercises!
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hi clkd, well what she said seems to make sense, but i suppose i will have to see what the exercises do in the 2 weeks :) she didn't suggest swimming no, i do know i have a problem with my feet i can see it when i stand and look in the mirror i haven't got flat feet but they do sort of flop in at the sides.
I have done the set of exercises once this afternoon and i will do them again after my bath in a minute before bed, anything to get rid of this hip pain and be able to walk again without pain.
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It won't happen over-night so don't look for a sudden cure! It is probably to build up the calf muscles in order to help gait.
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clkd, the exercises she has given me are for my back and hips, such as lying face down and arching my back and when sitting on the floor pushing my knees to the floor to open up hips, she said that everything is tight and it needs to be freed up, but like you say it won't happen overnight so i will keep going at them :) gotta be better than drugs to mask things, if it works.
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hi all, got up this morning really cheesed of with this low back hip pain, so i rang the surgery and have an appointment at 3.30 today with a prescribing nurse, out of all the people i have seen 2 chiropractors, osteopath 2 gps no one can actually point to anything which is causing this groin pain when i walk.
I have done the ice and rest thing for 2 weeks, i have done the stretching exercises i have had x rays and there is just no improvement.
I have spoken to my gp several times re the side effect of low back pain from my blood pressure medication and he says it's not that, well several times i have googled olmesartan (benicar) and found loads of people that have had this problem with it so i am going to tell them i want something else even for my own peace of mind, i need to know that i am not taking a drug every day which is causing this problem.
Sorry for the rant but i've had enough, its a beautiful day here today and other half has just gone off with the dog to walk in the woods and i am stuck here as i know i will be in pain if i go.
Not feeling sorry for myself just angry as i can't get to the bottom of this, will let you know what the nurse does. kerrie
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Groin pain is common when you have lower back pain Kerrieann - it is called referred pain and you need to target the cause of the back pain i.e. did the x-ray show any wear and tear of the spine or hip - to alleviate the groin pain.
I can see how frustrating it is - have you been given anti inflammatories to take as well as the exercises and ice pack treatment. It can take a long time to sort out back problems unfortunately.
Taz :hug:
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I can't take anti inflammatory due to stomach and blood pressure meds, they have given me all sorts of pain relief which totally knocks me out so i can't see the point, if i sit and rest there is no pain, only when standing for a while and when walking.
The x rays showed mild degeneration of lower back and 1 hip but all the professionals that i have seen say that i have good hip movement so its likely coming from lower back.
I mat be clutching at straws thinking that its a side effect but i have read so many comments on it and i have always had a big problem with medication of any sort i must be sensitive :( So i need to change the tablets just to prove to myself. kerrie
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I would think that a slight degeneration in the lower back may be enough to cause problems when walking and the groin pain could be because you are compensating in some way for the back pain i.e. you hold yourself more tensely when you walk without realising it and this puts pressure somewhere else leading to a referred pain.
It stands to reason I suppose that it worsens when standing or walking because there will be more pressure on the worn discs and they sort of grate together. Not very technical sorry! A course of exercises is necessary to build up the strength in the lower back - if your muscles are strong than this can help with any type of spine degeneration but I can appreciate that it takes a while to begin to work. This site mentions the fact that with spinal degeneration the symptoms will worsen when walking or standing but are relieved by sitting or lying down http://www.physioadvisor.com.au/8389550/spinal-degeneration-degenerative-spine-back-ar.htm
I can see that you would like to try a different blood pressure medication and if it weren't for the fact that your x-ray showed that you do indeed have degeneration in the lower back I might think you have a point but I think your symptoms point to wear and tear. It's a shame that you haven't been given a follow up appointment with someone who can advise you on how to manage it. You might find that if you do change your medication then you would get different side effects :-\
Taz
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I have disc degeneration in my lower back and the pain it caused me was unbelievable - some days all I could do was lay on the floor and cry it was so bad. I took turmeric capsules for the inflammation that work really well (my nurse suggested them) but I have to say it's starting to exercise that has really started to sort it out. It hurt like hell when I first started but 9 months down the line I'm better than I've ever been and no longer take anything for it. I'd definitely push for a different medication though as the one you're on could well be causing some of your problems.
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Taz, yes i do have a mild degeneration of the spine, but all the proffesionals that i have seen have said that its not enough to cause this much pain, i am certainly no wimp, but this groin pain when i walk is horrendous after just 10 or 15 min walk, they have seen the xrays and i can only go on what they tell me.
As far as the medication is concerned they are not working as they should i am on the lowest dose plus a water tablet and if i take them both every day my pressure is too low, so i take the water tablet every other day and its ok, but go not happy with me doing that, they also have side effects of sinusitis and very blurred vision which i have put up with, so i may well get side effects from a different drug but i can't really think of one which is worse than not being able to walk, IF that's whats causing it.
Greyhoundgal, when i do the stretching exercises it feels good, but it doesn't last so maybe when i have been doing them for a few weeks i will see improvement, what do you think? I will go and get some turmeric capsules when i have seen the nurse today and give them a try. kerrie
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:steamed: oh i am so angry, went to see nurse at 3.30 as i was told to do on the phone, re changing my blood pressure medication, once in there she said hi have you come for your blood pressure check ? i explained to her that i had come to change my tablets as i wanted to make sure this back pain wasn't a side effect from them and she told me that she couldn't change my medicine only the gp.
She apologized for the receptionist who gave me the appointment and said she would be going to give her a dressing down for it as she should know that the nurse can't change medication.
What goes on in this country today is no one capable any more ?
Anyway i have an appointment tomorrow at 5.00 with gp so lets hope he knows what he's doing.
Bad day today i might even have an indian takeaway tonight to cheer me up ;)
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greyhoundgal, quick question for you, or anyone else that may know, i was going to buy the turmeric capsules then i read that they can cause stomach upset, i have a very sensitive stomach but i do eat indian curries as often as i can ;D and they never upset my stomach and i believe they use turmeric in those so would i be ok with the capsles do you think ?
Silverlady, i just wanted to tell you that the exercise that you told me about is the same as the one that the physio gave me, so its one of the exercises i am doing, does it make any sense that when i do these stretches i feels really good and my groin feels free, but it wears off after about an hour, does this mean its doing good or is it just a temporary relief ?
Sorry for all the questions but i am determine to get to the bottom of this with or without the help of professionals, probably get more help on here to be honest ;)
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Kerrieann, I started to take the turmeric capsules after prescription anti-inflammatories gave me a very upset tummy. It was my nurse who recommended them as she had an allergy to the other meds. I found them to be very gentle but they did work - H&B do them, not very expensive so why not get just a small bottle and give them a try? I always have a tub handy these days although now with all my exercising I very rarely need to take them.
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greyhoundgal, i have been doing the stretching exercises from the physio since monday, as many times a day as i can, which is usually 3 times, and i have got to say that it feels great when i have finished, but after about an hour this wears off, now i don't really get this :-\ does that mean that if i keep going it will get better and better?
Sorry to be a pain but i know you have been where i am today ie can hardly walk without pain and we are going away in 3 weeks, last year this groin pain ruined the holiday as i couldn't walk anywhere, so i am trying very hard to do as iam told, hoping for some improvement in 3 weeks.
I know this is not a quick fix but do you remember how long after you started exercising that you felt any benefit?
I will be getting the turmeric as i defiantly cant take ant anti inflammatory. kerrie
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Turmeric is used to ease gut inflammation.
When I was in the Hospital we told patients to do their exercises on the hour every hour for 10 mins.; knowing that they would forget half the time! What were you advised?
Hip pain is always localised in the groin area.
Referred pain can 'go' anywhere ::).
We evolved upright - wrongly so. If you look at chimps they walk slightly hunched and forwards!!! low back pain is difficult to manage. You are 'going' the right way to getting some relief but it won't happen overnight.
Do you have a cycle? Can you go swimming - non weight bearing exercise can help as it exercises other parts of the body. It is important to keep any extra weight off!
Are you wearing 'those' particular shoes - as the physio said to do? Shoes can make a huge difference to our back and hip problems as wrong gait can mean that other parts of the spine compensate.
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clkd, the physio told me to do the exercises several times a day? i have been doing them 3 or 4 times a day.
The pain is in my groin, sometimes 1 side sometimes both, saw my gp today and he said its either coming from my hips or lower back, not very helpful :( I can tell you that the pain is the worst when i try to open my legs wide (no jokes thanks ;) ) ,when i get in or out of the car or when i climb into or out of the bath, and the pain is right in the groin, it feels bruised.
I don't have a cycle no, i gave away my exercise bike :( I could go swimming but it means me getting someone to take me and wait, as i took my car off the road at christmas so i am not driving at the moment, and i hate being a pain and putting on people, but i will be swimming alot on holiday in 3 weeks time, that how i spend my holiday :)
I have been wearing the correct shoes yes every day now for nearly 3 weeks, as for the weight yes i need to loose some but without being able to walk its difficult and i have put more weight on this year since this groin pain began. kerrie
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You Go Girl! Get into that holiday mood and swim, swim, swim: remind me; where are you going? Packed yet?
It's early days with regards the exercise regime. The muscles get lax and with pain the body compensates in posture so it puts strain on parts we don't know we own ::) ..........
Your GP is right. Lower back pain can be referred. There are lots of muscles and nerves in those areas! When you aren't wearing those shoes what is on your feet? I slop around in slippers :-X which is probably bad for me. I hate bare feet though ........
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For 3 weeks i have wore orthaheel sandals, which have an orthotic built in, and on wet days i have worn trainers also with an orthoheel insole, i am being very good ;D
We are going to majorca, went last year and like it, so going back, haven't packed yet no, but i have in my mind if you get my meaning, i know what iam taking and where everything is.
I just hope that if i keep doing the exercises 3 times a day the pain will be a little easier in 3 weeks time, i have got some turmeric and started them today, so don't know if there is much more i can do. kerrie
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Sometimes the container itself is the problem with the gut, not the ingredients ::) - DH uses Turmeric in his curries
Ginger is a good antiseptic as is honey ;)
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hi all, feel so fed up :( some of you may know we follow our local football team around the country have done for years and we love it, well today was our first home game and it was a good one, BUT i have been in absolute agony, it's a 10 min. walk from the car into the ground, all uphill and for the first 45 mins i was sitting and standing, as you do when it gets exciting everyone stands, but god, by half time i didn't know what to do with myself, my hips were killing.
We have just got back in the house now and i am sitting on the sofa, and there's no pain a bit stiff but nothing much, so sick of this i am.
I asked my gp yesterday to change my blood pressure meds, but he said it's not them causing the back and groin pain, so how come every time i google it people say that they have had terrible back and hip pain on olmesartan and the patients leaflet lists back pain as a side effect.
What would you do ladies ??
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I think that the pain from blood pressure medications is more constant. The fact that yours eases when you are sitting does point to a problem with your spine or your hips. Hip problems cause groin and lower back pain which worsens on standing and walking. The exercises you have been given should help in this respect and maybe your GP is waiting to see how you feel after a few weeks of doing them? A change in blood pressure medication can cause other problems and if your blood pressure is being well controlled on this particular one I can see why the GP is reluctant to change. I appreciate how frustrating it is though.
Hip pain info http://www.londonbridgeorthopaedics.co.uk/london-orthopaedics-hip-symptoms/
Taz x
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The gp has changed the 1 medication which was the water tablet, as when i take it with the olmesartan it brings my blood pressure down too low, so i am still on the olmesartan, which has the side effect of back pain, plus a new 1 to replace the water tablet.
I will continue with the exercises, although not tonight as i feel as stiff as a board, so will have a hot bath later for that.
I think the problem is that i feel i am getting somewhere, and then when i go out somewhere and walk i realize i am no further forward >:(
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You are trying to run before you can walk ::) - the first muscles to 'go' are those in the thigh i.e. quadriceps. If a person does less exercise they lose structure fast. You walked today and you are pain free on sitting. Do the exercises then have a bath. Same again tomorrow. Little steps ;)
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ok will do :)
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Lots of bubbles, Very Good Book and a cuppa ;)
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greyhoundgal, i have been doing the stretching exercises from the physio since monday, as many times a day as i can, which is usually 3 times, and i have got to say that it feels great when i have finished, but after about an hour this wears off, now i don't really get this :-\ does that mean that if i keep going it will get better and better?
Sorry to be a pain but i know you have been where i am today ie can hardly walk without pain and we are going away in 3 weeks, last year this groin pain ruined the holiday as i couldn't walk anywhere, so i am trying very hard to do as iam told, hoping for some improvement in 3 weeks.
I know this is not a quick fix but do you remember how long after you started exercising that you felt any benefit?
I will be getting the turmeric as i defiantly cant take ant anti inflammatory. kerrie
Sorry for the late reply, haven't been on line over the weekend. I'm glad to hear you're doing the exercises - they might hurt a little while you're doing them but will have a good effect in the long run. I think mine felt noticeably better after about a month so fingers crossed you'll be in less pain by the time you go away. Another thing I ended up buying (and wished I'd got one years ago) was a TENS machine - I got mine from a Lloyd's pharmacy and it was quite reasonably priced (under £40) - you just stick the pads on the bits that hurt, switch it on and it pulses away doing it's thing. It might be worth seeing if you can get hold of one, either rent one or buy one if you can - I use mine about once a month now just to keep everything working but have to say I honestly think the exercise has been the biggest help to me. If you are still in real pain about a week before your holiday it might well be a good investment to pay to see a private physio - the one I saw was much better than the one I was referred to through the NHS.
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DH used a tENS for several years - seemed to help!
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I have a tens somewhere at the back of the cupboard, now, i know this sounds daft but i don't know where to stick it ;D joking aside, the pain is only when i am walking or standing and it's sort of coming from the inside of the groin both sides and i am not sure if i could stick the pads there, the skin is a bit thin there isn't it ? and also it's in a crease in the groin.
Am i right in thinking that the tens is temporary pain relief ? in as much as it doesn't help anything get better but just dulls the pain?
I must sound like a nightmare, but i am a firm believer in getting to the bottom of what is causing pain, not masking it, if i get told by the consultant when i eventually get there, that they can't do anything then i will take pain killers and get on with life, my other half tells that keep worrying about is making it worse, but when you go to the supermarket and only get half way round and your in pain it's hard not to think about it :(
Other half is a bit annoyed with the gp for not changing my blood pressure meds. when one of them main side effects is back pain, gp just dismissed it saying it,s not the meds. i feel that if i changed it and still had the pain, at least that would be another thing of the list.
Bit of a long post sorry :)
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How long have you been taking the medication? I think back pain would have surfaced within the first few months.
tENS are useful in some cases but only if they can be put on comfortably ;)
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I have been on the meds. for 6 years and have had low back pain all the time, but it just came and went and never really stopped me from doing much, but in the last 12/18 months it's just got worse.
I am aware the people tell you not to google health matters, but i only have to type olmesartan into google and it brings up peoples reviews saying back pain.
Basically i wanted to try another med. as it will put my mind at rest that i am not taking a pill daily which is causing this pain.
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I have a tens somewhere at the back of the cupboard, now, i know this sounds daft but i don't know where to stick it ;D joking aside, the pain is only when i am walking or standing and it's sort of coming from the inside of the groin both sides and i am not sure if i could stick the pads there, the skin is a bit thin there isn't it ? and also it's in a crease in the groin.
Am i right in thinking that the tens is temporary pain relief ? in as much as it doesn't help anything get better but just dulls the pain?
I must sound like a nightmare, but i am a firm believer in getting to the bottom of what is causing pain, not masking it, if i get told by the consultant when i eventually get there, that they can't do anything then i will take pain killers and get on with life, my other half tells that keep worrying about is making it worse, but when you go to the supermarket and only get half way round and your in pain it's hard not to think about it :(
Other half is a bit annoyed with the gp for not changing my blood pressure meds. when one of them main side effects is back pain, gp just dismissed it saying it,s not the meds. i feel that if i changed it and still had the pain, at least that would be another thing of the list.
Bit of a long post sorry :)
Yes, it won't actually make your back pain better but will make it hurt less for a while if that makes sense? Ah, yes, awkward to try and find somewhere to put the pads although you could just place them along your lower back (avoiding the actual spine) - it certainly shouldn't make it worse so might be worth a go anyway? Can you make an GP's appointment with another Dr? They might listen to your concerns about your medication.
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hi greyhoundgal, yes i think i am going to make an appointment with a different gp at our surgery and see what they think, i was just going to post a question about footwear, i have been wearing my orthoheel sandal for 3 weeks now and this morning i found a pair of crocs in the cupboard, when i put them on they were so soft and spongy it felt like heaven to walk, i wont say it would cure me but they sure feel comfortable and a bit easier on the hips, question i was going to ask was re fit flops, do they have a soft spongy sole or is it hard ?
Should i have started a new post re footwear ?
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Flip flops are dangerous ::)
Stick to what your physio recommended!!!!
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oh my word, today i have the most horrible pain all the way down the outside of my right leg, sitting here now it's throbbing feels like sciatica, it going down to my ankle, still have the groin pain.
Does this give any ideas as to whether this problem is coming from my hips or lower back ?
Other half says i am thinking about the pain too much, i told him politely that he should try sitting here with this pain and see if he can put it out of his mind :cuss:
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Sounds like sciatica! I have it a lot in recent months. Moving around might help!
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This hip and back business is driving me nuts, i am told to rest if its inflammation but keep moving if it's not inflamed , well how i am i supposed to know :-\
I have had a letter this morning to see a clinition at the hospital, thats the 9th of september i don't know what is meant by clinition, i was lead to believe that i was waiting for an appointment to see a back specialist, is this the same thing ?
Clkd, i am moving around as i have excersies to do from the physio and i keep doing them several times a day but as for walking for more than 10,/15 mins i am in awful pain and my hips lock up.
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Ring the Dept and ask ? :-\
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Just been to see a different gp at the surgery and explained how i thought maybe, my back problems could be a side effect of blood pressure meds. and i was quite surprised when he agreed and said he would start me on a different one for a couple of months to see if there was an improvement in the back and at least i could cross that off my list of things causing it.
So off i go and see what happens.
I asked the receptionist what's meant regarding seeing a clinician and she said it is a consultant, don't know why they have to change titles of people it's just confusing :-\ but at least i will see a consultant now on sept 9, so hopefully i am getting somewhere :)
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Call a spade a spade I says ::)
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yea me too ;D
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We turned the mattress last night and today I altered the seating position in the passenger side as I could feel the nerve pulling as we travelled.
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I'm glad you've seen another GP Kerrieann - he at least sounds as if he is taking your concerns seriously. Is the consultant appointment before or after your holiday?
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greyhoundgal my appointment is when we get back from holiday, i had a phone call last 2 weeks ago to go to physio and have now been twice, when we had finished yesterday i told her about the appointment and said i wasn't sure who i was seeing, she checked on the computer and told me it is another physio that i am seeing, :-\ apparently then she will asses me and then i will be seen either by a consultant or maybe just carry on with the physio i have now.
So confusing all this is.
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Are you doing the exercises?
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I was referred to a physio as well but he was the one that could book MRI scans etc - so maybe that's the type you have to see. Keep up with the exercises though, even while you're waiting. What sort of holiday have you booked? Is it one where you will be able to sit and relax and perhaps do some swimming?
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yes i am still doing the stretches and the holiday is a beach type so relax ans swim.
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Someone else to carry the cases though?
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yep
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:clapping:
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It is an MRI scan that you definitely need kerrieann, I can't wait until 9th of September when I see the Consultant for the results of my scan, and then hopefully an injection.
These last few weeks have made my back so much worse with the toing and froing from the hospital, all the carrying plus all the stress, they say you should carry on doing things if you have a bad back but I don't think this has worked in my case, sometimes I feel like crying from the discomfort when all I want is to get on and do the things I have always done.
Kerrie insist on a MRI scan its the only way to find out what is really wrong.
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Silverlady, i know just how you feel, sometimes i feel like a fraud, but i just can't walk far at all without pain.
When i had this appointment come through, also 9th sept, i thought it was with a consultant but apparently its with another physio :-\ but when greyhoundgal said that she too had an appointment with a physio who could arrange for scans i felt a bit better, as it was i felt like i was going round in circles, when like yourself, i only want to know what is wrong and then take it from there.
At least your getting there now and hopefully will get sorted and maybe i won't be too far behind :)
Hope things with your other half are settling a bit now as it can't help having all that stress.
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quick update and your thoughts ladies please, i held the dog on his lead yesterday for about 20 mins walking round the pet shop, we are trying to get him to stop pulling on the lead, he's very strong, weighs 3 stone, anyway last night i could hardly move with pain in the bottom of my back and both hips, its making me think that my problems are from lower back and maybe the pain in my hips is referred from my back
Does that make sense to anyone :-\
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It makes sense to get someone else to walk him. You have a bad back ;) so any exercise that your frame is not used to will 'pull'. A long hot bath.
What type of dog is he? Have you tried a harness plus haltie and do you have a professional dog walker who could take him for you, to teach him?
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I think we talked about this before. I thought I posted a link further back in the thread. Lower back degeneration (wear and tear) which you said you have been diagnosed with can show up as lower back, hip and groin pain. It's sort of standard really. It is worse on walking or standing and improves with sitting or lying.
Treatment is by physiotherapy and painkillers. I know you have problems with some painkillers so we did suggest the gel I think - have you asked your doc for that if you can't take the painkillers prescribed? It might make a lot of difference.
Taz x
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Clkd, It was a 1 off, me walking the dog, other half walks him twice a day, but i get so fed up of not joining in as it were, that i said i wanted to walk him around the pet shop, my own fault :(
He is an 8 month old staffy and he is golden but gets so excited when out for walks that he pulls, he has a harness, and we tried him with a halty in the store but he kept pulling it off, little monkey.
So it's down to other half for walks, i am not one for sitting around so i am finding it very hard, we have had him nearly 7 months and i have only been out with them probably 3 times but i won't be doing anymore walking until i get this back problem sorted, it's just too damn painful.
I bought some hotter sandals 2 days ago and have worn them till today and my legs are killing me, so i rang the chiropodist that i see, and she told me that they were a form of exercise sandal and that i should have only worn them for a few hours a day till i was used to them, although she they would be good for my back, so i have overdone that now, can't seem to get anything right :-\ I will get there in the end .
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Taz, thats spot on, the groin pain is agony when i am walking or if i stand for a while, last night for instance i stood and made just 4 salad rolls and a drink in the kitchen and my hips were agony :(
I am having physio but just once a fortnight, and doing the exercises 3 or 4 times a day.
When i asked the gp about the gel he said, you may as well rub any cream into your skin as it will not penetrate, so they won't prescribe anymore :-\
I know that i can buy the gel but to be honest i don't really know where to rub it in, the pain is sort of right in the groins, skins a bit thin there, and if its coming from my lower back should i be putting it there ?
Can you advise me please
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Staffies do pull! Does he play ball? They like to run. Maybe go when he is out for a walk and watch? With a Staffie you need to be with other dog walkers on a regular basis so that they learn to be polite ;)
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yes clkd they do pull, my parents had staffys before i was born and i have had them all my life, they are lovely dogs if they are bought up properly, he does love to play ball and really loves other dogs, he has a few friends around where we live and gets so excited when he sees them out and about, he also loves cats and he doesn't realize yet that they don't like him ;D
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hi all, sorry i haven't been on here for around 6 weeks, hope everyone is doing well :) i posted this on the same thread as i wanted to let you know how i am doing with the back problem, so we had our weeks holiday in majorca and i was in exactly the same pain when walking that i was feeling a year previous :(
However on our return i kept my appointment with the head physio at our local hospital and he was so thorough questioned me on allergies, food i ate, my everyday life and couldn't understand the pain i was in with my hips when walking, that was until i told him that i have been using ice packs on my back several times a day for weeks, he looked at me in horror and said that i have arthritis at the bottom of my spine and that the cold was the worst possible thing for it :o so on his instruction i have been using heat packs instead and to our amazement my back is about 80 per cent back to normal, i am still surprised when i walk all around the supermarket without pain :) i know that there is no cure for arthritis but something so simple has really surprised me and when i think about it, its common sense ::)
On a different note my oh has been diagnosed with type 2 diabetes which we are trying to understand at the moment and finding it quite confusing but we will get there kerrie
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That is great news that you are getting the correct advice and treatment at last.
You can get stick on heat patches which are great for when you are out and about.
My hubby has Type 1 diabetes so I understand how you feel. Hopefully your dietician will be able to help you both understand what is happening.
Honeyb
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thanks honeybun, i have though about those stick on heat patches especially with cold weather coming
oh has an appointment with a dietician soon so hopefully things will be clearer then, at the moment he feels as if he has to give up all the foods he likes, he is a big meat eater and the only veg he will eat are peas and green beans so its a bit difficult, but from what i have read it sounds more like everything in moderation, but we will see kerrier
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Glad that you have found out what the problem is Kerrieann and sorry to hear about OH. Have you had a look at the Diabetes UK website? I found it very helpful when my mum was diagnosed http://www.diabetes.org.uk/
Taz x
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When my hubby was diagnosed we both went to see the dietician. She had lots of plastic fruit and veg that she arranged on plates. I found it very funny to be talked to like a five year old. I got a couple of good books from the library and read as much as I can.
One useful thing she did tell us was not to buy any diabetic food stuffs such as ice cream or chocolate. It's full of sugar :o.
You are far better to have a tiny amount of the real thing as a treat.
I am sure your hubby will get on fine and be able to control things through his diet.
Honeyb
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thanks taz, yes i will have a look through the website
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They used to have a forum but I haven't checked to see if it is still going.
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honeybun, he has been given medication which he has been taking for a month so far the side effects have been upset stomach and very tired and he is a bit annoyed by this as he says that he felt better before he new he had diabetes, i only managed to get him to the drs. because he has been complaining of aching legs for about 18 months, which the dr said is connected, but now in the last 2 weeks he is having a lot of pain in his 1 toe, we can't see anything but he has a appointment with a chiropodist on monday so she should be able to sort it out, all he feels is that since he has been on the medication he has more problems, its not easy convincing him that he must take the meds as he has never had any meds in his life.
I am sure things will get sorted and hopefully they will get his meds right kerrie
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My mum had upset tummy with one of the medications - I think it was metformin - gave her bad stomach pain too but they changed her to gliclazide and she was fine.
Taz x
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My hubby has never had pills. He was straight onto insulin injections four times a day. I think he would have preferred pills but it was not possible for him. His came out of the blue although looking back if he had told me I think I could have joined the dots and got him to the doctor before he was very seriously ill. There were signs but hindsight is a wonderful thing.
He has to be very careful with his diet but as you said it's all things in moderation even a little chocolate occasionally.
Being a typical bloke he fights it every inch of the way but I am bossy ::) and keep him right.
Get your hubby to take care because it can lead to type 1 and that's hard to cope with.
The forum that Tax mentioned has great advice.
Honeyb
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hi taz metaformin is the one he is on so maybe he could ask for a change when he next goes.
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Hi kerrieann so very glad you are improving, the head physio sounded very thorough , I was told that when inflammation start its best to use ice and then when it calms down to use heat.
I am on my third week of Osteopathy treatment and beginning to have improvement, she has told me to start heat treatment now.
Its a slow process but as I was told I have the problem for long time and it will take a while to straighten me out :)
So sorry about OH but you will have support from the ladies who know best how to deal with OH who had diabetes.
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Osteo arthritis is 'normal' joint wear and tear due to us evolving upright. If you look at our nearest relatives they tend to lean over, using their knuckles in order to balance. Therefore there is no direct pressure throughout the spine nor pelvis.
Glad that you are improving.
Ask for a change of meds for your OH tomorrow, don't wait or he will feel worse than he needs to feel! Note the name of the drug mentioned here and give the Surgery a ring ;)
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hi silverlady, glad to hear that you are making headway too, i was quite shocked to learn that i had actually been aggravating the problem instead of helping it but at least now i am feeling alot better.
I didnt think about it until i was told that the cold would make it alot worse, but the last 2 holidays we were on i said to my other half that, it felt a bit uncomfortable lying on wet towels when we were by the pool even though the weather was nice and hot, when you are in and out of the pool the towels dont get chance to dry and i think that must have made things so much worse :( o well we live and learn dont we kerrie
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clkd, dh has appointment on tuesday with the nurse so he will ask for a change of meds .
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:thankyou: