Menopause Matters Forum
Menopause Discussion => All things menopause => Topic started by: br350 on May 22, 2017, 03:21:00 PM
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I'm approaching 51, have been on 0.05 Minivelle patch w/200 mg natural progesterone 12-14 days every 6 weeks. I feel okay with the patch but the progesterone part just wrecks me: bloating, food cravings, lethargic, no motivation, etc. Yes, it's only 12-14 days every 6 weeks, but I dread them. I've never been wild about being on HRT. In truth, have mostly done it because I've read about its protective effects for bone health, cardiovascular, etc.
I want to be free of it! Others on here who have stopped....can you advise and comment? I should mention that when I started HRTI was only having very mild hot flashes even though I was measured with a very high FSH and estradiol at <10. At the time I started HRT, I had not yet gone 12 months w/out a period.
For what it's worth, I'm fit, appropriate weight for height, exercise vigorously and regularly (have for decades) and eat fairly cleanly, don't drink, don't smoke. I'm hoping I can go without HRT and pass through this okay. I think I made the mistake of reading way too many horror stories :o about menopause and now fear all the horrible symptoms that may occur without HRT.
Just looking for some kindred spirtis, some advice or any ideas.....thanks! ;)
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Hi just wanted to wish you luck :) I don't really have advice as I'm still on HRT, I have been off it for past few weeks and did feel my flushes slowly coming back but I've really got to take as still only 43, one positive off it was I slept better.
Anyway good luck you may be fine, I'm the same though read things about HRT I'm starting ect and scares you haha.
Everyone is different though my mum sailed through the menopause so keep positive xxx
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Lil22, thank you for responding. I am hoping to hear more from those who went through sans HRT.
I hope you feel better when you get back on it! And yes of course, at 43, you would definitely need something. Thanks for the helpful info in mentioning your mom-I'm glad to hear she did well. :). Good luck to you as well. ;)
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Hi TovaFell
I an 59 and had the menopause at 54. I started using the Evorel conti patch 2 years ago.
For many years I tried everything possible in Holland and Barrett, used to cost me a fortune! Nothing worked for me. I did special diets, even though I always eat good all the time. I had so many symptoms with the menopause - never wanted to use HRT. The bladder problems were really bad, I was in bad burning pain all the time and bleeding. I've always exercised every day, running, swimming and yoga, it never made any difference either. I saw a professor in Harley St when I was 57 and he said the only thing that would help is estrogen HRT. So although I was scared to use it, I didn't have much choice in the end. It has helped me so much.
I wish you luck and hope you find something that helps.
Vicky xx
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Vickypk, I'm glad you landed on what works for you as really that's all that matters. :)
I think I need to go without for a while and see what comes. One thing I have seen is that every woman is SO different in how symptoms hit and how bad they are.
I will give my body the time it needs to tell me whether I truly need it or not.
One good thing: I have an identical twin who is a year and a half post-meno and she has had absolutely no troubles at all.
I'm hoping our genetic makeup will speak for my experience as well.
Thanks for replying and I'm glad you are feeling better! :)
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I stopped hrt as couldn't find one that suited me.
All you can do really is try being without it. Keep being active,eating healthy ,he as upbeat and positive as possible ,in other words get on with living the best you can. ;)
Remember to put things into prospective,we are only a tiny portion of society on MM ! :)
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Thank you dazned! :) Yes, that's what I'm planning to do. Just see how I get on without it and take it from there. My life is very busy, full work load, etc and I try to just keep moving forward and not dwell too much about the 'what ifs' of stopping it. I guess I can go back to it if I truly need it.
I think I did myself almost a disservice having read everything I could get my hands on (mostly medical studies and reports) about HRT and convinced myself I 'needed' it or I'd shrivel up. Yet most of the women in my life who are older than me have never used HRT, and they seem to be getting on just fine. I guess we each just do what works for us! Thank you for responding! :)
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As I suggested if that was the case there would be millions of wizzened up women in the world !
;D
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Hello and welcome
I made the choice not to use HRT and I haven't. I don't know when my meno started as I had a hysterectomy in 1995 so I had no periods to work from. I remember my first hot flush and night sweat, we were on holiday in 2008 and I thought I had wet the bed (I was 51 then too)!
I do use Vagifem topical oestrogen for vaginal atrophy and I have had no trouble with thrush or cystitis since using it, 6 years now. I dealt with the flushes as they happened and a product called Magicool became my new best friend. For a time I could only wear cotton but I can wear man made fibres again now. I used St John's Wort for my moods. It wasn't an easy time and the worst bit was the insomnia, but from what I have read on this forum HRT is sometimes no picnic until you find one that suits.
I am 60 now and everything has calmed down and become much more stable. It was a bit of a bumpy ride but I am ok and better now and sleeping through most nights. Oh, and I don't have osteoporosis, and if I develop it I will deal with it then, and my ECG is perfectly normal :)
This is only my experience and we are all different but if you really don't want to use HRT and can manage the symptoms then you don't have to use it, it is your choice. It is great that we all have a choice :)
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babyjane, thank you! I appreciate you commenting and telling of your experience. I have always been a 'less is more' person and have generally preferred to let my body sort things out on its own. Our bodies have such a sophisticated hormonal system (the feedback loop and how complex it is) and I've heard of many women having such difficulty finding a dose/type of HRT that works for them - long term. Lots of back and forth and tweaking and adjusting. I have never been fully comfortable using HRT.
I think on some forums and in some articles I've read, I let it get into my head that HRT is necessary to stay healthy after menopause, but I'm not sure I'm buying it. I once asked a well-respected GYN/menopause doctor if she had to choose between prescribing diet and exercise or HRT (but not both!) to keep patients healthy, which would she choose: and she said it would be diet and exercise without hesitation. Although I understand they are not mutually exclusive.
I will see where this path leads for me. I also have a history of endometriosis (not severe, but have had several surgeries) and that has factored into my desire to approach menopause naturally. I am glad you are well. And it is very heartening to hear that you are not suffering from osteoporosis or cardiac issues. I understand and am in agreement about the use of a vaginal (local) estrogen. I will do that if/when it's necessary as I don't want to suffer atrophy/tearing and pain. :(
Again, thank you! :thankyou:
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Oh wow thanks Babyjane - I hadn't heard your story before (unless I'm doing my goldfish impression again... This is me at work: what's that? I said that 4 mins ago... yes of course I realised that... I was just checking you were listening, you looked a bit vacant, frankly... ;D)
So pleased you've got through OK babyjane and now you're feel better. Blummin' brilliant. There is hope then... even though I'm weird and extreme maybe I can get there too. 9 years tho... arrgghhh can't they just knock me out like an induced coma and wake me up when I'm better/they've found a cure for basket cases like me? I'd pay handsomely for such a service. I wonder if there's anyone who'd do it? Could I D.I.Y it?... ::) Seriously these are the things I think about...
TovahFell how great you don't get yucky symptoms. I can't even begin to imagine that, but good for you, and long may it continue. If you did have problems and you don't want the progesterone that troubles you there's non-progest HRT called Duavive. http://www.mims.co.uk/drugs/obstetrics-and-gynaecology/menopausal-disorders/duavive
Haven't tried it myself, and know nothing else about it... but when did that ever stop me sticking my oar in ;D
Obviously I am not a doctor and I am not giving medical advice, just letting you know this exists.
Good luck to all! Just 8 years and 7 months to go for me :o xxx
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I'm cheering all you lovely ladies on, and welcome TovahFell! :)
Seriously - HRT is a choice for all women in natural menopause. It's totally up to you what you feel comfortable with. Lifestyle plays a HUGE part in how you stay healthy as you age, and most women who have experienced a natural menopause do just fine.
Babyjane has kindly shared her story and its truly inspiring - way to go, BJ! I know you've said it was rocky at times, but you seem very much to be in a good place now.
Much love to you all! xxxxx
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P.S. How's the Toblerone going btw, Edelweiss? Have you titrated up to a full bar yet? I hope you're remembering to add the gin in every 12 - 14 days - very important! ;) ;D xxxxx
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Dearest Tempest re Toblerone - start low, go slow is my guide. I'm adding a quarter of a chunk a day.
24hr gin is still an option, though another member said she can recommend Cab Sauv and if given intravenously it has added advantage of looking like a unit of blood! Priceless. ;D
OK is it time to knock myself out yet? Cos my head's banging, my ears are ringing, and my fanny is on fire and I'd prefer to be unconscious.
Bit of a catch me... ;D
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Hi TovahFell
:welcomemm:
Sorry to hear about your problems with HRT and especially the progesterone part. I sympathise with that! I try to take it as little as possible and on a long cycle.
I am guessing you are in Aus or NZ as I don't recognise the oestrogen patch?
The guidance is that women should take HRT at least until the natural average age of menopause which is 51/52 if possible - to help protect as you say - against osteoporosis and cardiac problems. You have almost reached there so you will now be on a par with women who reach menopause naturally on average. The stats seem to point out the long term benefits of HRT and that many diseases and conditions can be minimised or prevented if HRT is taken. There is a paper you may have seen called The Prevention of diseases after menopause or something similar which discussed it all ( sorry a bit tired to look it out but you could google it). Came out in 2014 or 2015 for World Menopause Day. Many conditions don't become apparent until much older age than 60 so the longer you can take HRT for can lead to greater protection provided you are not medically ill-advised to do so ( eg endometriosis?).
The current thinking is that the benefits exceed the risks for women under 60 who are experiencing symptoms so if you fall into this category perhaps try not to worry. Nevertheless I totally agree that diet and exercise and lifestyle are equally as important for health - it would be not point taking HRT if one is overweight, a couch potato drinking a couple of glasses of wine a night and eating lots of sugar and processed foods!!
Anyway as has been said the decision is yours. I take my progesterone vaginally on a long cycle with the sanction of my doc to minimise the negative side effects of the prog. Perhaps this is something you might like to consider?
If you do decide to stop and symptoms come back - well you are young enough to restart again quit easily. Do let us know what you decide :)
Hurdity x
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Thank you edieweiss and tempest! It is early days yet, as they say, and it could well be that I'll be clamoring for my HRT patches at some point down the line.
I'm not yet off the patch but have stepped down to a lower dose. Some weeks I leave the patch on all week rather than doing the twice-weekly change, etc.
Truly there are as many ways to get through menopause as there are women. :) Nothing cookie cutter and no one approach. I am continually amazed at how varied women's reactions are (physiologically) to HRT, as well as how some women get hit with every symptom, some only a few, and others nearly none. It's a quandary to say the least!
I'm a sort of "cross that bridge when I come to it" type person but never say never. I'm sure many a woman has made her mind up one way of the other (about hormones), only to reverse completely based on changing/evolving circumstances.
The chocolate and Gin doesn't sound too bad to me! ;). Thank you for your kindness in replying to my post. :thankyou:
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Hurdity, thank you for this info! In hindsight, I'd wished I'd waited to even begin the HRT until I knew my periods were done. At the time I started in 2015 I was still cycling, albeit very infrequently. I sort of wanted to get 'ahead' of it. But not knowing if I'm fully in meno is now my real question.
I will go off for a time and see how I feel. As you say, I can go back if need be. I've read nearly everything I can get my hands on regarding HRT. Tried to stick with mostly published research and reputable medical websites and follow the research of well known menopause specialists/researchers/experts.
I'm not medically contraindicated from using it because of the endometriosis, however when I first began the patches, the higher dose one (doctor thought best to start higher as I was 'young') gave me lots of discomfort like I had with endo. So for me, low dose has been key.
I have never used progesterone vaginally. Unfortunately, I don't think it would work for me as I'm too 'active' to want to deal with the leakage and what not. My original GYN had said I could cycle a 12-day dose every 10 weeks or so, but he has since retired, and my current prescriber is not in agreement with less frequent cycling. He would prefer optimal endometrial protection and does not feel confident in the less frequent dosing.
I'm not ultimately convinced of the absolute 'need' for HRT to start with - that's part of my dilemma. Most of the women I know in their 60's and 70's are doing just fine and never used it. I feel if they have managed so well, why not I?
Quite honestly, I think I allowed myself to feel scared by much of what I read in forums :( and that's my own fault. I know for some women, this is a quite horrible passage, I do, but I also try to remind myself that likely the women that are out there enjoying their lives, perhaps not having bad symptoms, and who have passed through doing well, are not the ones usually posting.
Lots of good for thought, and I'm so grateful to hear different perspectives. Thank you so much! I will chew and digest all this info. A wonderful group of ladies you all seem to be! :)
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Good on your TovahFell! I hope you do really well and feel great, whichever route you take. All the best to you xxx
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Maybe make a diary: chart mood/food/symptoms and decide which symptom you want to remain free from? If you didn't have too much problem previous to HRT then maybe ease off, stop and decide? You may find that you have nil of note ;).
I was lucky in that the various symptoms that can be troublesome didn't last for long, i.e. no more than 6-7 months. The flushes happened after my evening bath as did the itchy skin ::) - anxiety and depression were already being treated.
As oestrogen levels drop off so the body may become dry = itchiness: deep in the ears, eyes, skin, vagina (be wary of *that* one)! as well as muscles may become lax = aches and pains which should be eased by over the counter medication; many ladies find that they suffer indigestion or acid reflux :sigh: which is where the diary can chart any symptoms after foods.
It's The Change tha' knows >:( ::)
Will you let us know how you get on?
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Eh bah gum! Tha's some good tips there, our CLKD! ;)
You're most very welcome, TovahFell! :) xxxxx
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:lol:
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CLKD, what an excellent thought. ;) For years, Ive been recording my exercise/workouts and also keeping track of my HRT use. I will do the same thing when I decide to stop. For many years I used natural family planning for birth control, and then to get pregnant. I learned so much about my body and my cycles doing this (keeping records and charting) It is one of the key ways I knew I was well into peri, if not finishing it up - for at least 6-8 months prior to starting HRT, I no longer experienced the cyclic temperature rise that happens post-ovulation when progesterone increases in the luteal phase of the cycle. This was a key indicator for me that my progesterone had tapped out and I was no longer ovulating. Any periods I was having were anovulatory and likely shedding from having excess estrogen in relation to very low progesterone.
Sorry for that tangent! LOL! Anyway, I will follow all of the advice on here and report back as to how the weeks/months go by. I have an appt with a new GYN next month (mine retired last year) and will also discuss all of this with her. I definitely will want to maintain vaginal integrity and at the very least, would consider Vagifem or other local estrogen if I stop and dryness becomes an issue.
This journey is so unique for all of us....the stories are as individual as the women who tell them. I am so appreciative and grateful to all who have responded and offered thoughts and advice! :bighug:
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can I just add that every day is not plain sailing, I don't want to present a 'pollyanna' type approach to where I am in my life.
I still get bad days, I get anxiety, I get joint aches and I get the occasional sweat or flush. It has not all beautifully melted away. What it is, it is manageable and there are many good days. On a not so good day I can deal with the blips.
Overall things are better and I have no reason to believe they will not continue to be so :)
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babyjane, and that's the way of life anyway, isn't it? We all have periods of time where we feel like crap, or things are just 'off'. I never expect to have indefinite periods of harmony - I'll take what I can get! ;) All we can do is take very good care of our bodies, get proper rest, nutrition and any other modality we see fit to try, and then get up each day and start again! Thanks for sharing!
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You are right and can I say this - don't over exercise :gym:.
If you have been used to exercising all your life then there is no reason to stop :spin:. However if mild or moderate exercise has been normal for you then please resist the scaremongering media/press who would have us all over-exercising in a bid to ward off old age :hapij:. I did this and caused myself physical harm so now I exercise at a level that is right for me, and that is not the same every day either :bunny:
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Hi, I have been researching a product/supplememt which has a facebook group of 80'000 following it called "Happy Hormones" and many women are taking this to balance their hormones instead of HRT and seem very happy! Aussie company, will deliver to UK and USA. Maybe worth checking it out. You could also try the ladycare magnet!
Anyway good luck!
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babyjane, good point. Yes, like everything in life, moderation is important. I agree. And what is a heavy level of exercise for one person may be light for another. Just listening to our bodies is so important! thanks!
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sweetie222, thank you. ;) I will pop over there and check it out!!
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It's means flying though TovahFell ;)
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TovahFell,
Just wanted to jump in and wish you huge amounts of good luck.
I started HRT in Feb 2010 (aged 47) for panic attacks, unable to sleep, frequent hot flushes, no sex, and felt like my world was falling apart. And for a while all was great (except the libido which was still reduced). I changed HRT formulation around Sept 2011 (can't remember why, think I may have started feeling emotionally 'flat'), and by March 2012 I knew I had to come off. I just wasn't feeling myself, it was keeping the flushes at bay but nothing else, so I weaned myself off over 2 months, by gradually reducing the dosage.
It wasn't too bad to start with, besides the shocking VA, for which I was prescribed Vagifem, which helped a fair bit but didn't completely sort things out, sex was still an issue, but it had been when I was on the HRT anyway - still zero libido.
I didn't push to try any other HRT because I thought I'd have the same side effects with whatever I took. I stayed HRT free until I finally pushed for a referral to a Gynaecologist in July last year - just over 4yrs since I'd stopped, in desperation, as I realised I was trying to convince myself that I was managing, but I really wasn't. I was miserable, exhausted, had no sex drive and completely pissed off - and the stupid thing is now I can't believe it took me so long to realise I felt that way, and that I might not have to feel that way.
And that's what you need to be aware of, coming off HRT IMO. You might be fine and not have any issues, but do try and be more self aware than I was and seek help and advice before things get really bad if they are heading that way. For me it wasn't an overnight 'suddenly feeling crap', it was a gradual sink to the bottom, and to be honest the flushes were the least of my problems.
I have to add my story does have a happy ending - I started Tibolone & Ovestin (in addition to Vagifem) last September and basically I have my life back. I feel like I did in my 30's (without the PMT & periods), sex is brilliant, I feel energised and can exercise 4 or more time a week. I feel so lucky that I've found something that suits me so well. Yes it's not perfect & I've had the odd side effect along the way (see my diary), but the longer I'm on it the less I seem to be getting.
HTH,
Sooze
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Hi TovahFell- I'm really interested in your story as I too am thinking of coming off it as I've been struggling on it for nearly 2 years now and getting nowhere with GP practice, reluctantly went private. I'm now on oestrogel and utrogestan but it's just not agreeing with me and I'm going to see consultant again on Saturday- my mood is very low and I've no doubt that I'm progesterone intolerant. I've always been anxious so maybe I have a predisposition towards depression anyway but my body is now telling me that it's not doing me any good whatsoever.
Given that the consultant has said that I will go through the menopause anyway when I do decide to come off it, I reckon I need to try it now. I'm dreading it but I also dread staying on it. So, like you, I'll just need to wait and see how it goes. I may need to go back on it but all my instincts are telling me that it's not working and I need to try and get my life back. I have also gone down the herbal route before starting HRT with limited and short lived success.
Truth is, HRT just doesn't work for some women.
Do keep posting and I will too. Best of luck
M x
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Ladies, take heart. I tried HRT many years ago (tried twice) and I just didn't take to it at all so I decided to go through without if I could manage. I won't lie, it was a bumpy ride at times but it does not last forever and I am now out of the worst of it.
You need a few things in place to help you through and they are this forum and the ladies here who really know and understand, a supportive partner/family if at all possible or a really good friend, cans of Magicool spray, a 4.5 tog duvet, St John's Wort if it is not contraindicated with any other meds you take and a sense of humour if you can muster it plus cotton clothing in layers that can be shed easily.
I do use Vagifem topical oestrogen for VA and that is essential treatment but no systemic HRT at all.
I realise it will be harder to manager if you have to go to work, I was fortunate in that I did not have to work any more than I wanted to.
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baby and Stella janes- thanks for the tips. I'm virtually sleeping just with a sheet and that's me on HRT!
Never heard of Magicool- am going to google it now x
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Hi again Tovahfell
I haven't really read through all of this thread since going away but just to say ( hope I haven't already!) that I came off HRT completely 6 years ago and by the time 3 months had elapsed all the symptoms had returned as badly as before ( flushes and sweats) as well as a pelvic ache/dragging feeling which meant I had to sit down and put my feet up in the evening - it was most uncomfortable - and I have been back on it ever since.
I did try reducing to 37.5 mcg also about 3 years ago but flushes started to come back on this dose so went back up to my usual dose of 50 mcg.
Re the VA - it is best not to wait until you get VA before starting on vaginal oestrogen as it takes some women some time to achieve symptoms relief. If you have stopped systemic HRT then your oestrogen levels will be dropping and it is very likely that you will experience some bladder/vaginal symptoms as a consequence. I would urge you to start local oestrogen straight away so that this does not occur.
I am also a great believer in exercise ( well obviously don't run a marathon if you've never run!!) as being vital for our continued good health in later years - and it is never too late to start ::). It goes without saying that this should be built up slowly until you are fit but no need at all to "slow down" as one ages!
Anyway do let us know how you continue to feel and hope that this is good :)
Hurdity x
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Michelemabelle - best of luck to you, whatever you decide! I think we just need to listen to our bodies and do what feels best/right for each of us. I will keep you updated. Please update us as well. :)
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Hi, I have been on this journey for 4 years without hrt and it has been horrendous at times, the anxiety, dizzy head feeling, day flashes, night flushes, joint aches etc etc, I could go on and on, last summer I was at a very low and just hid away from the world and cried and nearly caved in to hrt but I didn't. I want to get through this as naturally as I can and if that means me being a moody bitch now and again I don't care. My hubby is very supportive bless him, I'm not surprised he hasn't packed up and gone lol. I'm mentally a strong woman and will get through, hope you find the best plan for you, I walk and read my way through it I think, best of luck flower xxxx
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I keep hearing that once you get through it, things even out. I work with at least a half a dozen post-meno women (in their late 50's and their 60's). None have used HRT and their lives are busier, fuller, and more active than mine! LOL! I think some women just do not have as hard a time with it, and that's just one of the mysteries of life. I'm sorry it's been rough for you. 😞 I try best as I can to be upbeat, and not focus on negatives or symptoms. It's a journey for sure!
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Some women have very little symptoms. My mum barely noticed it, just felt slightly hot a few times and is fine now in her 70s, not on any medication or has had VA.
After oestrogen starts to fall, I've accepted a natural menopause will be better for me as I have migraines from high oestrogen but all we can do is test it and see.
Good luck!
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dangermouse, most of the women I know in my life have managed fine post-meno and none used HRT. My mother-in-law has a far busier and active life than I do, and and she's nearing 80! Where are you at with menopause? That's part of my wanting to stop. I started HRT before I'd been 12 months without a period....started 2 years ago at age 48, so I don't yet know if I'm fully in menopause. I turn 51 in a few months. I'm guessing I'm post. I wish, in some ways, I'd never started because at least I'd know! Now I have to wait and see.....
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I try best as I can to be upbeat, and not focus on negatives or symptoms. It's a journey for sure!
That's great to hear Tovahfell and the best way to be if you can - what's the point of examining every niggle and wondering what is the cause? My main aim (with HRT and menopause) is to feel the best I can for most of the time, do what I can to improve my health generally, ignore side effects etc that I can cope with - and ride through them, and then get on with making the most out of life :). Sadly life experiences and events do not permit this for some people.
Hurdity x
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Hurdity, very well said! :)
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dangermouse, most of the women I know in my life have managed fine post-meno and none used HRT. My mother-in-law has a far busier and active life than I do, and and she's nearing 80! Where are you at with menopause? That's part of my wanting to stop. I started HRT before I'd been 12 months without a period....started 2 years ago at age 48, so I don't yet know if I'm fully in menopause. I turn 51 in a few months. I'm guessing I'm post. I wish, in some ways, I'd never started because at least I'd know! Now I have to wait and see.....
I'm at some kind of perimenopause stage where I'm having oestrogen surges, causing nausea type migraines around ovulation, and am hoping they calm down as I near meno. However, I may go the opposite at menopause but all the info here means I'll be well armed if I do decide to start oestrogen therapy.
Don't regret trying it, your natural cycle (or non-cycle!) will show its face soon enough and you can assess how it feels then.
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dangermouse, I hope that it settles down for you soon, as I can imagine how difficult that is with the surges. :( I got those surges up until around 2015, then they stopped late that year. They were not fun. I didn't have migraines, but had other associated high-estrogen type misery. :(
Here's hoping for the best for us both going forward! I plan to keep this post updated. I hope others will too! ;)
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Dangermouse, as you know my migraines were horrendous through peri. Everything was tried, saw utterly brilliant specialists across a number of disciplines and eventually all agreed that I just had to go cold turkey into a natural menopause. They were all convinced the migraines would stop. Over the last few months they really have, which is nothing short of miraculous. I've gone from at least 4-5 days in bed a week to only one migraine that responded to meds last month.
My oestrogen surges through peri were off the Richter scale, all was measured regularly. The plummets caused as many problems though. As I was frequently told, I needed the hormones to plateau which is where I have been since September.
You'll get there ladies, hang on in! x
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Thanks both, and am always encouraged by your posts Elizabethrose about how yours have calmed down and all your really helpful posts about migraines.
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THANKS tovahfell- keep posting.
I'm dropping oestrogel down this week and reducing even further next week before coming off completely. Must admit, I feel like a wet weekend so far...
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I'm inspired by this thread. I'm going cold turkey for a bit. I worry about osteoporosis - in the family, and I have osteopenia - but I just need a break and to see how I feel without the mirena in.
I would love to go naturally through this if I could. I wish every woman could
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Noheroicsplease, best of luck if you try. I have no idea whether it will work out for me in the long run to stay off of it. But for me, I'd rather approach it from lifestyle (diet, exercise, sleep, adrenal health, watch thyroid, etc). Everyone has their own way and their own preferences. There is also the very low dose patch (0.025) that is used for bone health only. You could consider that if you cannot do other things to offset the ostopenia. I think some of that is hereditary? A good friend of mine has very 'strong bones' in her family. Her mother is in her 70's, never touched HRT and was told at her last bone scan that she has the skeleton of a 20 year old! :o And she does not exercise - so go figure! Best of luck and let us know how you do! :)
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It is heredity to a certain extent - worryingly so...
What is the low dose patch you speak of? Oestrogen only? So I would have to take progesterone...
I have a very healthy lifestyle, which I rely on. I'd also try chinese herbs again if I had to.
Oh, I don't know. I have no idea what shit storm of symptoms are ahead of me!
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noheroicsplease, In the U.S. there are several that are 0.025 or 0.020 patches. I believe one is called Menostar. The other is called Minivelle. Both are estradiol patches with the indication for bone protection solely. So they probably wouldn't stop hot flashes, etc. I am sure these types of patches must be available (different manufacturers) in the UK as well. I am tempted to consider one down the line. And from what I hear, you would only need to use progesterone maybe once every 3 months at the most (a 10 or 14-day course) due to how low an estradiol level these patches produce in the body. Likely one could opt to have a womb scan yearly as an alternative to be sure lining is not thickened. But clearly it would need to be discussed with the prescribing GP. I hope that helps! I am trying to not anticipate bad things in terms of symptoms. I find it's better to just plough ahead, go about life and not focus on it. I hope you do well and feel well - sound like you are taking very good care of yourself!! :)
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Thanks Tovah! I like your style.
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;) :thankyou:
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I'm wishing all you lovey ladies the very best of luck who are stopping HRT. :)
For me, and having no ovaries, it's not doable at this time of my life as much as I wish it were. It took just over 3 months to hit absolute rock bottom, and its no fun at all. I thought I could go back to how I felt 1 year post surgery (which was ok) but a lot has obviously changed in my body since then.
Take it very steady, and do remember to rest as well as exercising etc. Your adrenals need it as they are going to have to take over where the HRT left off to a large extent, as hormone production shifts to the adrenals as ovarian hormone production declines.
Much love to all of you! xxxxx
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Thank you Tempest for your kind message. I think having no ovaries makes for a different circumstance entirely, and can see why you'd need some replacement. I hope it works for you! I wish you the best with your HRT journey!! :)
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Thank you so much, Tovah! :thankyou: xxxxx
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So, I had my yearly GYN appt with a new practitioner (my former GYN retired - he was a gem) and she advised I not stop until the summer is over because the high heat/humidity we've been having. She said it would be much easier on my body to wait a few months until the fall weather/cooler temperatures. At that point, I can start cutting the patch or drop down to the next one (which is the very lowest available).
She was phenomenal. I've not had a female practitioner in ages. She is maybe 10 years older than me and said she's been through it all and is sympathetic. I felt that she had a very thorough knowledge about HRT, the history of its use and all the issues surrounding recommendations for using/not using it based on both past and and more recent studies of HRT use. All in all, she was a delight to dialogue with.
So for now, after really having a good think on her recommendation, I will remain using the patch and revisit in a couple of months. I will be glad when i finally transition off of it though. The progesterone part is just...ugh.
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I wanted to update this thread (formerly br350). After the appt., I went down to the 0.025 patch as the manufacturer was out of stock on the 0.0375 until Aug/Sept! They couldn't say why, but I had several pharmacies trying to source that strength patch and none could get it. So I went down to 0.025.
So far it's been fine. Minimal, if any hot flashes. This surprised me since this patch is only indicated for bone health and not symptom relief. It's a tiny dose. I am still using natural progesterone, 200mg x 10 days every 5 weeks or so. I think that's a lot of progesterone for such a tiny amount of estradiol but it is what it is. I do not even get a bleed. Just a tiny bit of brownish spotting for a day or two at the very most.
I've noticed that my breasts are definitely looser and my sleep is not as good. But I cannot complain at all compared to what some of you have experienced (heart goes out to those having a rough time!). I just wanted to update this thread as I know many people comment and then not update a thread and I am always curious how people get on.
Hope everyone is doing okay!
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Thanks for the update weathergirl and to hear how you are doing on the 25 mcg patch. Hopefully your symptoms will not get any worse....and if so this will be reassuring to others. Some women do seem to be fine on this dose and especially when later in menopause. Also to say that in UK only a 50 mcg patch or higher is licensed for treatment/prevention of osteoporosis although lower doses do give some protection.
I know the looser breast feeling - mine were completely floppy without HRT!
One day I might also try to reduce again but I'm doing OK at the moment (apart from the dreaded prog!) ::)
Hurdity x
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Thanks Hurdity!! :) Yes the 0.025 patch is licensed in the US for bone protection only. The distinction being that it will not increase bone, but will stop additional loss. So you will stay at whatever bone density level you're at when you started that patch. Certainly higher dose patches provide additional bone benefits but
I am okay staying at this low dose - at lest for now. ;)
I'm very much hoping to stay at the 0.025, but will not rule out bumping back up if I really need to. I wouldn't have gone down to this lowest patch yet if the 0.0375 had not gone out of stock.
I don't mind the loose breasts as they are so small, I'm fortunate they don't sag. One tiny silver lining to a minimal bust! LOL! xxxxx